The Running Thread - 2019

[Professor_Cookie]

ATTQOTD 26.2 beer: I am not much of a beer person. Anyone wants to suggest a 26.2 cocktail recipe?

I’m going with a gin Mary.

 

[Ellie_]

@Sleepless Knight @Waiting2goback @Chaitali thank you all for your helpful advice. I fully plan on committing myself to whatever plan I end up with and yes, this is my first full. I’ll do some more research on finding a custom plan

 

[YawningDodo]

So...I made a new thread for it in order not to hijack the discussion, but my festering anxiety about training for the half marathon in June has turned into very real "oh no, that's not actually possible" thoughts. Drop in and give me some advice?

I got my wish, though, regarding weather. It was 14* above zero when I went out to run this morning, and boy howdy it felt great. Still dressed too warmly; having trouble getting the hang of it. I was just going to do a lap or two around the park but then I saw other runners out and decided to go on an adventure and do the 3.3 mile loop that takes me up one side of the river and back down the other (past the waste water treatment plant, which I hear is good training for WDW race conditions??). Pretty good overall except the pedestrian section of one of the bridges had not been plowed/shoveled and it was the world's longest trudge over dirty packed snow.

Also! I finally tried my Hydraquiver out in real world conditions and I absolutely love it. I think it would be uncomfortable to wear with a sleeveless shirt, which may create issues in the summer, but it really does stay put between your shoulder blades and I was surprised at how easy it was to get the bottle in and out of the quiver as I was walking (did not try during any of my run intervals). My only complaint is that in order to get it to sit high and comfortable I had to tighten the shoulder straps to the point where my arms were slightly restricted, though it didn't cause any discomfort or problems during the run. It just might be annoying if you were trying to do anything with your hands.

 

[Disney at Heart]

@LSUlakes It was not a "real" race, but I paid for it and will get the medal later. Soooo...
I completed my Star Wars virtual race this morning. 13.34 miles in 2:28:12. I came in 2nd place overall; DH won first place because he's faster than me.

ETA: Looked back at runDisney. There is no mention of a shirt for the virtual or Kessel races, only for the Rival Run.

 

[Waiting2goback]

@Sleepless Knight @Waiting2goback @Chaitali thank you all for your helpful advice. I fully plan on committing myself to whatever plan I end up with and yes, this is my first full. I’ll do some more research on finding a custom plan

There are many schools of thought on plans. You kind of need to just figure out what you want to do. I kind of like the weekly mileage philosophy where I focus more on my total weekly mileage and not so much on long runs in the 20+ range. I go with an 18 mile long run for marathons and higher weekly mileage.

When I ran my first marathon I was running 8 miles for my “easy runs”.

But your goal for the actual race matters too. Is it to run a certain speed or just to finish and be able to walk the next day. All these things factor into which plan you pick.

 

[bphilb]

Is anyone running the half marathon in Creve Cour, Missouri tomorrow?

 

[Miranda]

I think it would be uncomfortable to wear with a sleeveless shirt, which may create issues in the summer, but it really does stay put between your shoulder blades and I was surprised at how easy it was to get the bottle in and out of the quiver as I was walking (did not try during any of my run intervals). My only complaint is that in order to get it to sit high and comfortable I had to tighten the shoulder straps to the point where my arms were slightly restricted, though it didn't cause any discomfort or problems during the run. It just might be annoying if you were trying to do anything with your hands.

Sadly this is the problem I have with my Hydraquiver. I don't wear sleeveless shirts, but some of my short sleeved ones have very short sleeves and the straps do chafe me because sometimes the sleeves bunch up under it and leave bare skin. I love how it feels though. I didn't find that I felt restricted if I fixed my posture... usually if I feel restricted, I'm hunching forward.

 

[baxter24]

I ran the Wrightsville Beach 5k and half marathon this weekend. The 5k was a Friday night at 6:20 and the half and full were at 6:40am the following morning. This was my second time running the half and first doing the 5k.

5k and Expo: Bib pickup and the race took place on UNCW’s campus. I ended up arriving about 2.5 hours before the start of the race since I was coming in from out of town so I ended up just hanging out on campus until the start of the race. Packet pick up was easy and the expo was small so it didn’t take long. The name and theme of the 5k was a Glow Run so volunteers were passing out glow sticks for everyone to wear. People either didn’t secure them or decided to ditch them shortly into the race because everyone was dodging them on the road. The course ran the perimeter of the campus and was on sidewalks and walking paths. Towards the end of the race, it was dark and I was running by myself at some points so I ended up speeding up a little just so that I was running near people. My only complaint for the race was the kids that ran the race. I think it’s great when kids do races but there were a ton of kids who ran by themselves and would do the “sprint ahead and immediately stop in front of people” approach over and over. I was able to pass all of them by the first mile but that’s always frustrating, especially when you are running on a sidewalk.

Half: The race starts over at Wrightsville beach and finishes over at UNCW. I bought a shuttle pass that took me from campus to the start. I boarded the bus at 5:15 and ended up waiting at the start for a little over an hour. Weather was nice. Hovered right at 50 degrees and only dropped little the last mile when it started to rain. The race for me was a tale of two halves. I was feeling really good through the first six miles. Pace was in the high 9’s but felt good. And then mile 7 kicked in and my body just decided I was done. I started getting side stitches and my legs felt really heavy. Ended up having to slow my pace and walk through aid stations and then a little after. I finished in 2:19 and was wanting to finish 10 minutes earlier. I guess I should question if I should have done the 5k but I didn’t push it and got a good nights sleep. I felt good when I woke up so who knows what happened. Just chalking it up to a bad day.

I’d still recommend the race. Course was flat, had plenty of aid stations, good spectators, etc

 

[Ellie_]

There are many schools of thought on plans. You kind of need to just figure out what you want to do. I kind of like the weekly mileage philosophy where I focus more on my total weekly mileage and not so much on long runs in the 20+ range. I go with an 18 mile long run for marathons and higher weekly mileage.

When I ran my first marathon I was running 8 miles for my “easy runs”.

But your goal for the actual race matters too. Is it to run a certain speed or just to finish and be able to walk the next day. All these things factor into which plan you pick.

Funny you mention that because I was leaning toward picking a plan that focuses on weekly mileage. That seems more do-able to me. My goal is strictly to finish upright, haha. I’m doing several other races throughout the year, for those I’ll definitely focus on meeting speed goals.

 

[DopeyBadger]

Looking for some advice from you running experts!

I’m committing myself to the 2020 WDW marathon and I’m shopping around for the right training program. Does anyone have any suggestions for marathon training programs I should look into? Ideally I’d love to be able to download an app on my phone to keep track of the daily workouts.

Thanks!

Late to seeing this but agree with others. Find something that fits your life, your past running history, your goals, etc. I think the most important part may be less which one of the great training plans you choose (Higdon, Galloway, Hansons, Daniels, McMillan, Pfitz, Fitzgerald), but making sure you read and understand the instructions. Most plans will have a handy calendar that says run 4 miles on M, 5 miles on W, 12 miles on Sa (just made up numbers), but in the instructions it will really explain how fast you should be running these, what kind of WU is involved, what you should be paying attention to during the run. I believe that's the key to the training plan. Less so the mileage, and more so how each day is executed. The biggest question you should be able to answer is, "Why am I doing this training run?". "What purpose does it serve?" Knowing why you're doing something makes you more invested in it.

Me personally, I advocate for custom training plans. Something written around your schedule, your life, your history, your current fitness, your past results, your injury history, etc. Fit the training plan around you and your life and not the other way around. Of course when it comes to a marathon training plan, my ideas might seem wildly counterintuitive. Aim to not exceed 150 min for a continuous runner or 180 min for a run/walker. For some that may end up being 20 miles, but others that may mean a max of 11-12 miles. How could one possibly run 26.2 miles on race day while only running 11 miles max in training. How can I also concurrently spend 80% of my training about 20% slower than my marathon goal pace? So I'm going to run slow and train for far less in a single run than I will on race day? And the funny thing is it does work as a method. It isn't easy, but it does work. The basis of which is in physiology more so than anything. But when you get in the nitty gritty of many of the other plans and their instructions/books you may find that these concepts aren't all wildly counterintuitive, but rather echoed by many others.

Here's a series of posts that I think would be helpful in evaluating training plans:

Training Load

-A longer thread from earlier in 2018: The Beginner's Guide to Stravistix or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the TRIMP (started by @kleph)
-An explantation of the terminology and whether "Fitness" = Pace: "Fitness" and "Fatigue"
-More isn't always better
-Finally figured out how to apply the mathematical formula of Stress Score, "Fitness" and "Fatigue"

Now the parts that will be more interesting.

Training Load Calculations on Different Training Plans for Different Fitness Profiles
-Covers the following scenarios.
--4 hour runner vs 6 hour runner using traditional Galloway Advanced Marathon
--4 hour runner choosing between traditional Galloway Advanced Marathon and a hybrid with 4 days per week but minimized long run
--6 hour runner choosing between traditional Galloway Advanced Marathon and a hybrid with 4 days per week but minimized long run
--4 hour runner vs 5 hour runner using Hansons Advanced
--4 hour runner vs 5 hour runner using Hansons Advanced; Determining appropriate Base training
--4 hour runner vs 5 hour runner using Hansons Advanced; A Secondary method to make Hansons Advanced appropriate for 5 hr runner

Training Load Calculations on Different Training Plans for Different Fitness Profiles: Part 2
--Covers the following scenarios.
--4 hour runner choosing between Hansons Advanced and Higdon Advanced 2
--4 hour runner missing the last long run in Hansons Advanced: What truly happens to training load when you miss the last big training day???
--4 hour runner missing the entire peak week in Hansons Advanced: What truly happens to training load when you miss the entire peak week???
--4 hour runner who chooses to increase the long run in Hansons Advanced because 16 is just too short

4 hour marathon runner choosing between Hansons Advanced and Hansons Beginner

Training Load Calculations (What happens when the next cycle starts?): Part 3
--Runner decides to follow up 18 week Hansons Advanced with another 18 week Hansons Advanced starting right after the Marathon ends
--Runner decides to follow up 18 week Hansons Advanced with another 18 week Hansons Advanced starting 2 weeks after the Marathon ends and takes some time off
--Runner decides to follow up 18 week Hansons Advanced with 12 week Hansons Advanced starting 2 weeks after the Marathon ends and takes some time off
--Runner decides to follow up 18 week Hansons Advanced with 10 week Hansons Advanced starting 2 weeks after the Marathon ends and takes some time off
--Runner decides to follow up 18 week Hansons Advanced with 12 week Hansons Advanced starting right after the Marathon ends

2019 Training: A Macro View

 

[Professor_Cookie]

@LSUlakes put me down for one more.

11/16 Dead Horse Ultra 50k, (NG/NA)

That’s the final one, I swear.

 

[JClimacus]

@LSUlakes put me down for one more.

11/16 Dead Horse Ultra 50k, (NG/NA)

That’s the final one, I swear.

"Dead Horse" is a great name. What's the origin? There is a Dead Horse Beach in Salem next town over from mine that actually had a dead horse. Is it because trying to ride a horse for 50k would result in a dead horse?

 

[flav]

Not sticking to a plan in order to love running... Or a summary of the discussion I had in my head with this thread during my long run today


So many QOTD and discussions we have here end up being processed over (running) time... One migt recognize looking at weather before a run, being visible, on the opposite side of the road, gears choice, motivation, etc. Thanks for all your inputs.

I had looked at the weather forecast yesterday to time my run so I rolled out of bed thinking « I have to beat the rain »... Turns out I was already too late, it was pouring and freezing so I figured, might as well wait until it gets warmer. My goal is not to be completely miserable. We ended up with a suprise snowstorm so, this afternoon, I dressed light, put spikes on my shoes and left for my longish run. I was careful to avoid cars and snow removal trucks. And I had to talk myself into being happy to run. Ouch.

I finally put a finger on one of the nagging feeling I had: It is impossible to embrace the current weather/road conditions, love running outside AND successfully stick to a plan. So, after almost five months of trying to approximately follow a plan, I give up until... WHEN?

I will stay in maintenance mode and run three times a week to achieve a monthly distance of 100k (62 miles) and have fun doing so but when is a good time to resume speed work? I figured, after I register for Dopey 2020! Yahoo!

I am basically writing this to reiterate that knowing why I run and checking in my inner fun at doing it is so important!

One thing that saved me this crazy winter is that I had a time based plan. Conditions are so slow that it would take me forever to cover a given distance and would leave me frustrated. I will remember that lesson for the harsh months.

The next one is that snow and ice make it impossible to maintain proper form but are great to reinforce ankles. I will celebrate that one by virtually putting the cost savings for a Bosu training ball into my runDisney fund.

 

[Professor_Cookie]

"Dead Horse" is a great name. What's the origin? There is a Dead Horse Beach in Salem next town over from mine that actually had a dead horse. Is it because trying to ride a horse for 50k would result in a dead horse?

It’s the name of the state park it is in, Dead Horse State Park. There’s a 50 mile and a 30k being run with it. It’s right next to Canyonlands National Park, so an arch or two, Canyons, hoodoos, should be fun. I’m headed down to run in Arches on Tuesday so I’ll get ya some pics.

 

[DIS-OH]

A couple of amusing anecdotes from my weekend:

Ran on our HS track this morning. A new surface was put down last fall but the lanes have not been painted yet. It was a bit disconcerting.

Went to a show pig auction to buy 4-H pigs for our granddaughter. Very excited as all of the barns and show arena at our local fairgrounds were bulldozed last year and new ones are being built. The community is doing lots of fundraising to pay for the new buildings. The local Bar association (lawyers) just announced their fundraiser...a 0.5 K run or “a race for the rest of us.” For $35 you can run 0.5K from one local watering hole to another. For an extra $15, you can ride a shuttle bus instead of running! It’s also being advertised as your chance to pass two bars without studying!

 

[ChattaDIS]

Over the next year or two there will be a lot of changes/suspensions/firings in College Basketball.

Wade should of talked to the university president. There is no reason not to. He and miller both have to go under oath shortly so that should end their college coaching careers. Miller all but resigned last night. Will be interesting to see who else goes down with this.

 

[rteetz]

Wade should of talked to the university president. There is no reason not to. He and miller both have to go under oath shortly so that should end their college coaching careers. Miller all but resigned last night. Will be interesting to see who else goes down with this.

I’m honestly surprised Miller still coached this year.

 

[Waiting2goback]

 

[AntimonyER]

Is Johnson's still there? Near the corner of 301 and Fair Ave.? That was the popular spot when I graduated!

No. Although the one I am referring to (Two Guys) is not far from there. (Zetterower and Fair Rd).

Not sticking to a plan in order to love running... Or a summary of the discussion I had in my head with this thread during my long run today


So many QOTD and discussions we have here end up being processed over (running) time... One migt recognize looking at weather before a run, being visible, on the opposite side of the road, gears choice, motivation, etc. Thanks for all your inputs.

I had looked at the weather forecast yesterday to time my run so I rolled out of bed thinking « I have to beat the rain »... Turns out I was already too late, it was pouring and freezing so I figured, might as well wait until it gets warmer. My goal is not to be completely miserable. We ended up with a suprise snowstorm so, this afternoon, I dressed light, put spikes on my shoes and left for my longish run. I was careful to avoid cars and snow removal trucks. And I had to talk myself into being happy to run. Ouch.

I finally put a finger on one of the nagging feeling I had: It is impossible to embrace the current weather/road conditions, love running outside AND successfully stick to a plan. So, after almost five months of trying to approximately follow a plan, I give up until... WHEN?

I will stay in maintenance mode and run three times a week to achieve a monthly distance of 100k (62 miles) and have fun doing so but when is a good time to resume speed work? I figured, after I register for Dopey 2020! Yahoo!

I am basically writing this to reiterate that knowing why I run and checking in my inner fun at doing it is so important!

One thing that saved me this crazy winter is that I had a time based plan. Conditions are so slow that it would take me forever to cover a given distance and would leave me frustrated. I will remember that lesson for the harsh months.

The next one is that snow and ice make it impossible to maintain proper form but are great to reinforce ankles. I will celebrate that one by virtually putting the cost savings for a Bosu training ball into my runDisney fund.

It's funny, I had similar issues with my run, but for opposite reasons. It ended up being in the mid-80s and pretty humid during my long run yesterday, and by the end I was also talking myself into being happy I ran. At least your issues with weather are coming to an end here soon... Mine are only beginning.

 

[PJofNB]

I finally put a finger on one of the nagging feeling I had: It is impossible to embrace the current weather/road conditions, love running outside AND successfully stick to a plan.

This sums up my current feelings! I have been mostly running on a short indoor track this winter, but it gets pretty boring. Both Saturday and Sunday warmed up to just below freezing, so I enjoyed outdoor runs on consecutive days for the first time in a long while. Our forecast has daytime highs above freezing throughout the week, so maybe spring really is coming soon!

Long runs are great times for thinking things through. Your strategy sounds great!