NO MORE free valet parking for DVC members.

[WebmasterDoc]

...
Actually, it isn't an emotional issue for me. My homebase is Saratoga were valet parking is a non issue. My favorite place to stay is OKW, where again valet parking is a non issue. But some places I'd like to stay have TERRIBLE parking, and paying another $12 a day for valet basically makes staying there a non-issue. That's a shame. I've lost overall value to my DVC membership because of all the places I cannot stay now as a result of this asinine change.

Where you stay is absolutely your choice. It is NOT that you can't stay a resort because free valet is not offered. You can stay there - you are just choosing NOT to stay there. The overall value is something only you can value. If you feel you have lost value, that is your decision and yours alone.

Imagine if tomorrow they announced you could ONLY stay at your home base and 1 or 2 other places.

That is absolutely possible - and could be changed by the owners at any DVC resort without Disney's involvement. DVC members do have the option of replacing DVC as the managing entity for their resort is they wish - and doing so would immediately remove that resort from the DVC family of resorts. That is something well within the realm of the owners at that resort. (NOT a likely situation IMO, but possible.) Those owners would then be free to hire new management for their resort or to even have a Property Owners Association (POA) manage themselves. They could then contract for all services and perks themselves.

I'd imagine that negotiating with Disney for transportation, housekeeping, textile services (laundry), maintenance, landscaping, front desk ... and perks, would be a real challenge. Of course. those owners would then have no other exchange options with other DVC resorts, no DME, package delivery, etc. - but they would be free to package whatever perks they wanted for their membership. They could also negotiate with RCI or II or any of the other timeshare exchange programs so that those owners would have some exchange opportunities. Keep in mind that this ability already exists and is outlined in the POS documents. So, even though we were all sold DVC memberships with the understanding that DVC would be managing the resorts, the framework was already spelled out where DVC could be replaced by a vote of the owners at ANY resort - without regard to what any individual was promised before purchase. The POS is an interesting document.

It is certainly possible that a member could be restricted to stay only at his/her own resort with no outside exchange opportunity.

The POS is an interesting document, indeed. Be careful what you wish for ...

 

[dianeschlicht]

But when is enough, enough? There are those complaining because cash guests get free DDP, cash guests can buy the Platinum plan, cash guests this and cash guests that.

When does Disney finally throw up their hands and figure there is no satisfying some DVCers? All we are legally entitled to is what is paid for by dues, nothing more. And what can be paid by dues is regulated by timeshare law. Every discount, every little freebie is a courtesy extended to DVCers by another entity, not an entitlement.

You really think an outside service contractor should provide free services just because you purchased a timeshare from Disney?

Is it any wonder DVCers often have a bad demanding reputation among CMs?

I agree with Chuck. Why should they give us anything just because we bought a timeshare??? Frankly, I'm happy with just the AP discount. As I see, it that is a plus plus for both Disney AND DVC members. We get the discount, they keep us coming to the parks. They really don't need anything beyond that.

As for valet...I do not NEED to park valet. There are always non-pay options when I stay at resorts that offer valet.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Where you stay is absolutely your choice. It is NOT that you can't stay a resort because free valet is not offered. You can stay there - you are just choosing NOT to stay there. The overall value is something only you can value. If you feel you have lost value, that is your decision and yours alone.



That is absolutely possible - and could be changed by the owners at any DVC resort without Disney's involvement. DVC members do have the option of replacing DVC as the managing entity for their resort is they wish - and doing so would immediately remove that resort from the DVC family of resorts. That is something well within the realm of the owners at that resort. (NOT a likely situation IMO, but possible.) Those owners would then be free to hire new management for their resort or to even have a Property Owners Association (POA) manage themselves. They could then contract for all services and perks themselves.

I'd imagine that negotiating with Disney for transportation, housekeeping, textile services (laundry), maintenance, landscaping, front desk ... and perks, would be a real challenge. Of course. those owners would then have no other exchange options with other DVC resorts, no DME, package delivery, etc. - but they would be free to package whatever perks they wanted for their membership. They could also negotiate with RCI or II or any of the other timeshare exchange programs so that those owners would have some exchange opportunities. Keep in mind that this ability already exists and is outlined in the POS documents. So, even though we were all sold DVC memberships with the understanding that DVC would be managing the resorts, the framework was already spelled out where DVC could be replaced by a vote of the owners at ANY resort - without regard to what any individual was promised before purchase. The POS is an interesting document.

It is certainly possible that a member could be restricted to stay only at his/her own resort with no outside exchange opportunity.

The POS is an interesting document, indeed. Be careful what you wish for ...

In reality, that is what those who own the Fairfield property have. On site, but their own "perks".

 

[crisi]

How is it not a cheap one to run? It has virtually no overhead. No buildings or facilities to maintain. No machinery to buy, lease, repair, or replace. Insurance is about the only cost of any significance. I'm sorry but a valet business is about as cheap and simple as it gets.

Perhaps you could go back and read the thread where we itemized out the business reality of providing valet parking?

You obviously aren't happy. Sell your points. You bought understanding the program was something it wasn't.

 

[Chuck S]

How is it not a cheap one to run? It has virtually no overhead. No buildings or facilities to maintain. No machinery to buy, lease, repair, or replace. Insurance is about the only cost of any significance. I'm sorry but a valet business is about as cheap and simple as it gets.

There is certainly at least a central office and bookeeping staff to maintain. Florida law requires that tipped employees are paid a minimum wage that is NOT offset by tips. It is a lower wage than non-tipped employees, but it is not an insignificant amount... over $4 an hour. Nor does the business itself benefit from tips, tips do not pay the overhead, income from operations pays that. Parking cars free does not generate income.

If the only issue here was free valet I'd agree. But I have seen a systematic eroding of benefits, a consistent and significant decline in the quality of staff, overcrowding at former off-peak times, overselling of special events, a transportation system that has nearly collapsed under its own weight, an inability to reasonably make restaurant reservations, and a variety of other similar serious problems. The free valet parking is part of an overall very ugly problem.

Look at how long it took to get them to stop pillaging us financially for internet access. They were making an obscene profit off that and it nearly took an act of Congress to put a stop to that.

You are obviously very unhappy, not only with DVC, but also the Disney company as a whole, as many of the perceived problems you mention are not DVC related in any way. If I were that unhappy with my purchase, and with Disney, I would sell my DVC and not visit the parks as a cash guest. There are other parks out there, why spend $$ and time with one that makes you so unhappy?

 

[DebbieB]

Actually, it isn't an emotional issue for me. My homebase is Saratoga were valet parking is a non issue. My favorite place to stay is OKW, where again valet parking is a non issue. But some places I'd like to stay have TERRIBLE parking, and paying another $12 a day for valet basically makes staying there a non-issue. That's a shame. I've lost overall value to my DVC membership because of all the places I cannot stay now as a result of this asinine change.

I own at BWV and stay there most of the time. I previously used valet for convenience at check-in and check-out but the rest of the time used the self-park. There have been issues on weekends not being able to find a space but I would never not stay there because of it. It's not that far to the lot. If someone has a disability, they can still get free valet.

 

[Simba's Mom]

Am I correct that they gave us free valet parking for approximately 12 years (from the time BWV opened) until recently, then suddenly decided it was no longer profitable? But it was for 12 years?

 

[Chuck S]

Am I correct that they gave us free valet parking for approximately 12 years (from the time BWV opened) until recently, then suddenly decided it was no longer profitable? But it was for 12 years?

Not exactly. When valet service was first introduced, valet services were provided by Disney, not a contractor, and was free to all onsite guests. Disney eventually began charging non-DVC guests, but continued to provide the freebie to DVC, those with disabilities, and DDE/TiW card holders (if dining). When they contracted out the valet services, the contractor continued to do so, likely to "get his foot in the door" looking towards future profitability. Upon renewal of the contract, the contractor no longer offered the perk to DVC, and quite likely Disney does not want the valet CMs back under their own corporate umbrella, paying wages, taxes, unemployment insurance and benefits in what, for Disney, was not a profit center. In those years there have been cost increases, both in required wages, and certainly in benefit packages, like health insurance, to where the cost could no longer be absorbed to offer the free perk.

Notice that the DDE/TiW card price has increased from $50 or so for AP holder to $75, so TiW my be funding the parking perk at an agreed upon base price.

DVC does not want to fund the perk through dues, and evidently Marketing or other divisions have no desire to fund it for DVC Members.

 

[Simba's Mom]

Not exactly. When valet service was first introduced, valet services were provided by Disney, not a contractor, and was free to all onsite guests. Disney eventually began charging non-DVC guests, but continued to provide the freebie to DVC, those with disabilities, and DDE/TiW card holders (if dining). When they contracted out the valet services, the contractor continued to do so, likely to "get his foot in the door" looking towards future profitability. Upon renewal of the contract, the contractor no longer offered the perk to DVC, and quite likely Disney does not want the valet CMs back under their own corporate umbrella, paying wages, taxes, unemployment insurance and benefits in what, for Disney, was not a profit center. In those years there have been cost increases, both in required wages, and certainly in benefit packages, like health insurance, to where the cost could no longer be absorbed to offer the free perk.

Notice that the DDE/TiW card price has increased from $50 or so for AP holder to $75, so TiW my be funding the parking perk at an agreed upon base price.

DVC does not want to fund the perk through dues, and evidently Marketing or other divisions have no desire to fund it for DVC Members.

Aha, now I think I understand. Thanks, this has puzzled me more than made me mad (what makes me mad is only that we never even knew this perk existed until it didn't!). I appreciate the answers.

 

[Glamis]

Where you stay is absolutely your choice. It is NOT that you can't stay a resort because free valet is not offered. You can stay there - you are just choosing NOT to stay there. The overall value is something only you can value. If you feel you have lost value, that is your decision and yours alone.

This is a luxury item. Everything is a factor of choice. The fact remains, they significantly lowered the value of my ownership because many resorts are now off limits because the parking is so horrible.

The POS is an interesting document, indeed. Be careful what you wish for ...

I'm not wishing for it whatsoever. Part of why DVC costs a lot more than other timeshares is the faith you have in Disney as a company that they won't pull such crap.

But if we roll over and let them consistently erode benefits, lower the quality of staff, lower the quality of the parks, etc. they will continue to push as far as they can get to squeeze every dime of profits out of us as possible.

 

[Glamis]

Perhaps you could go back and read the thread where we itemized out the business reality of providing valet parking?

That's nice. It is still an extremely cheap business to run so I'm not sure what your point is.

Compare it to running a restaurant or a steel mill perhaps.

 

[Glamis]

Am I correct that they gave us free valet parking for approximately 12 years (from the time BWV opened) until recently, then suddenly decided it was no longer profitable? But it was for 12 years?

Pretty much.

Basically, some propeller-head accountant somewhere wanted a promotion, saw a way to squeeze out some profits, and pushed through this idea.

They will continue to find more ways to trim benefits and lower quality of service if we just roll over and say "its ok, I'm just glad you let me pay you thousands of dollars a year to come see Mickey."

 

[Chuck S]

That's nice. It is still an extremely cheap business to run so I'm not sure what your point is.

Compare it to running a restaurant or a steel mill perhaps.

Why should any contractor, no matter how much the service cost, provide that service for free because you purchased a timeshare? You purchased the timeshare from Disney/DVC NOT the valet contractor. Disney/DVC no longer operates the valet service.

It is the same as expecting Blockbuster to give you free movie rentals because you bought a timeshare from Marriott.

Again, as unhappy as you seem to be with Disney as a whole, including DVC...it is obvious it is no longer of value to you personally...no longer a relaxing, desirable vacation destination for you. Wouldn't it be better to sell the membership, get most of your money back and move on to vacation venues you would enjoy more?

Personally, I still enjoy Disney, I still find OKW an enjoyable destination. I still find value in my DVC ownership, as do most owners. When/if I no longer want to vacation there, I'll either use the RCI trade options or sell.

This is a luxury item. Everything is a factor of choice. The fact remains, they significantly lowered the value of my ownership because many resorts are now off limits because the parking is so horrible.

Why is the resort "off limits?" The self-parking itself hasn't changed, nor has the valet. You simply have to pay for the services you receive now. Access to the resorts is the same as always, only now there is a service charge.

 

[Brian Noble]

I think we're at the troll-feeding stage.

Glamis thinks it's horrible. S/he will not be convinced otherwise. The rest of the known universe seems to have accepted it for what it is. Impasse.

Glamis: if you really want to stay in one of those other resorts so badly, cough up the $12/day plus tips. It's a drop in the bucket of the total cost of a DVC trip. If you can't see your way to that point, well, the POS never guaranteed you the ability to stay at those resorts.

 

[dianeschlicht]

I think we're at the troll-feeding stage.

Glamis thinks it's horrible. S/he will not be convinced otherwise. The rest of the known universe seems to have accepted it for what it is. Impasse.

Glamis: if you really want to stay in one of those other resorts so badly, cough up the $12/day plus tips. It's a drop in the bucket of the total cost of a DVC trip. If you can't see your way to that point, well, the POS never guaranteed you the ability to stay at those resorts.

 

[tgropp]

I think we're at the troll-feeding stage.

Glamis thinks it's horrible. S/he will not be convinced otherwise. The rest of the known universe seems to have accepted it for what it is. Impasse.

Glamis: if you really want to stay in one of those other resorts so badly, cough up the $12/day plus tips. It's a drop in the bucket of the total cost of a DVC trip. If you can't see your way to that point, well, the POS never guaranteed you the ability to stay at those resorts.

No, I am sure that if you took a poll (PLEASE DONT), you would find that people have not accepted it, they are just tolerating it. When people think of Disney, they think of that company going the extra mile, because lets face it, Disney is not a cheap vacation and DVC is a lot more money than other timeshares, including the dues which seem to be skyrocketing. I am still very happy with my DVC purchase, but I am very worried about Disney itself. If I had a crystal ball and could see the Disney corporation 20 years from now. I don't think that I would like what I would see. JMHO..... But its Still the happiest place on earth.

 

[tjkraz]

...DVC is a lot more money than other timeshares, including the dues which seem to be skyrocketing.

I'm not sure how applicable the word "skyrocketing" might be. With VERY few exceptions (like unplanned maintenance at Hilton Head), dues are steadily increasing at a 2-4% clip. That's to be expected as employee wages and benefits cost more, fuel prices fluctuate, utilities, etc.

Nevertheless, since you think DVC costs a lot more than other timeshares, I'd be curious to see some detail on that POV. How do DVC annual dues compare to other timeshares in the central Florida area?

 

[Dean]

DVC is a lot more money than other timeshares, including the dues which seem to be skyrocketing.

In general DVC is not more (or dramatically more) than most timeshares retail and there are many that are significantly more than DVC. DVC often is more than most resale because DVC is more liquid from a sales standpoint and has more intrinsic value than many, but not all, timeshares. Dues are high, generally around 20-30% higher than other comparable timeshares, but the yearly increases has been reasonable. However, it is still the SAME timeshare system we all bought into with MINOR changes over the years. I realize some of those minor changes are/were important to some, but from an overall system standpoint, they were all minor.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

No, I am sure that if you took a poll (PLEASE DONT), you would find that people have not accepted it, they are just tolerating it. When people think of Disney, they think of that company going the extra mile, because lets face it, Disney is not a cheap vacation and DVC is a lot more money than other timeshares, including the dues which seem to be skyrocketing. I am still very happy with my DVC purchase, but I am very worried about Disney itself. If I had a crystal ball and could see the Disney corporation 20 years from now. I don't think that I would like what I would see. JMHO..... But its Still the happiest place on earth.

Whatever pre-conceptions most people have about a trip to DL or WDW, it rarely includes a feeling that things will be free or even cheap! Valet parking is still available, so there has not been any decline in service, it is just that it now costs oop, currently $12 per day. As already noted in previously posts, this price is less than many other resorts charge and is the same amount charged to any person using the service at the WDW resorts.

For us, it means when we stay at our home resort of BWV we wil be less likely to use valet parking. For us, however, it doesn't mean I am going to stop taking trips to WDW. I still find owning DVC and travelling to WDW to be a good vacation value, even if I have to pay for valet. -- Suzanne

 

[dianeschlicht]

Whatever pre-conceptions most people have about a trip to DL or WDW, it rarely includes a feeling that things will be free or even cheap! Valet parking is still available, so there has not been any decline in service, it is just that it now costs oop, currently $12 per day. As already noted in previously posts, this price is less than many other resorts charge and is the same amount charged to any person using the service at the WDW resorts.

For us, it means when we stay at our home resort of BWV we wil be less likely to use valet parking. For us, however, it doesn't mean I am going to stop taking trips to WDW. I still find owning DVC and travelling to WDW to be a good vacation value, even if I have to pay for valet. -- Suzanne

How dare you react with a common sense answer!