NO MORE free valet parking for DVC members.

[Tara]

Just a thought! What if....... whenever points are bought the member receives the "perks" that are current ALWAYS!!!!!!!This way there would be no unhappy members as the supposedly level playing field would be just that!

No unhappy members??!!!?? I'm sorry, but that's never, ever going to happen. People tend to want not what the got, but anything they perceive as better. You ever watch what happens when incentives change right after someone buys in? And just how much do you think it would cost to administer every type of perk and keep up with who gets what? Sorry, I don't want my dues going up to allegedly "level the playing field" and I don't think differing perks make it level anyway.

 

[crisi]

I'm 90% sure that Disney funds ME as a marketing expense and not out of an operations budget. That keeps their gross profit margin high, and puts the expenses in SG&A. SG&A expenses are considered by the financial community as more "disposable" and easily cut, where CoGS isn't. So that would make their income statement look a lot better. If that is where it is, it won't show up in our dues (and we are functionally "free riders" on the marketing for the resorts).

They could be funding it out of operations, but I really doubt they would. I suspect when they tire of it as a marketing expense they'll start charging for it. Right now, it continues to keep people on property and away from spending their dollars at Universal.

 

[Tara]

They could be funding it out of operations, but I really doubt they would. I suspect when they tire of it as a marketing expense they'll start charging for it. Right now, it continues to keep people on property and away from spending their dollars at Universal.

Which is precisely why they'd never choose to cut it over cutting free valet to DVC members (assuming free valet actually cost them money). Free valet doesn't really MAKE them any money. ME keeps money inside the gates.

 

[NewDCLGuy]

We also do not know exactly how ME is funded.

I've got no complaints about the perks we do and don't get. Disappointments maybe, but no complaints.

However, I do think it ridiculous we aren't told how our money is spent by the company we hire to run the resorts for us. If we are paying for ME, it shouldn't be a secret.

 

[linney94]

Many of the discount perks are offered by a non-Disney operated business. For instance, Fulton's occasionally offers a 30% discount to members. Are you actually saying, that in order for Fulton's to offer that perk, it should need to be a PERMANENT perk for members that purchase during the time period that they offer it? If that is what you are saying, perks would disappear completely before any business would commit to a permanent discount.

Are you saying that if you purchased DVC during the time that the DDP included tip and appetizer for $38, that the price should never increase and it should always include tip and appetizer. If that were true, DDP would never have been made available to DVC at all.

Gosh, I have obviously aroused deep feelings! Actually,on reflection,my reference to "perks" was misguided. When we joined in 1994 we enjoyed;free valet parking;full clean on points quicker than now,and on trash and tidy day the beds were changed!;towels replenished whenever we needed;unreserved pool hopping-seasons or specific pools;we also had the option of calling for extra coffee,tea ect. which actually we thought was def. a step too far and should need to be paid for!,but none the less it was available to others-we are never looking for a free ride! I could go on but feel sure you get my gist.These are what I was refering to in my earlier post,and having read the curt replies realised my mistake in considering them perks.Non the less they have disapperared and detract from the "Disney" experience for us. Lastly, pool hopping for us is BIG. Having used Disney hotels and then DVC for 30 odd years now, we seldom-if ever-go into the parks. Our time at WDW and DC is spent lazing by the pools,shopping,and using the resort restaurants in the evening.We therefore miss the variety of pools with the constant limitations impossed by DVC. From our observations at Christmas when we have NEVER seen a pool that is anywhere near capacity(far too cold) we wonder why!! it's restricted.P.S. never have never will want or need DDP.

 

[tjkraz]

$12 per day plus tips for valet parking on property we own? That's the worst deal ever.

$12 is the fee for the service provided...not for use of the land. There is land available for member use with upkeep funded by member dues. It's called self parking.

As for the value, Universal hotels charge guests $15 per day for self parking and $25 per day for valet. In metropolitan areas you'll pay far more than $12 per day for either self parking or valet.

Then go with a contractor who wanted the easy business more.

When you're giving away the service for free, it isn't called "business", it's called a hand-out.

Why would any company settle for an average of $3 per car when they could earn $12 per vehicle?

Perhaps they would have been willing to continue the free service if DVC members were good tippers. That way at least the staff could receive additional compensation. Unfortunately most valet parking attendants will tell you that--as a whole--DVC members are notoriously poor tippers. Apparently in the minds of many, "free parking" means no out of pocket expense whatsoever. Too bad.

 

[Chuck S]

Gosh, I have obviously aroused deep feelings! Actually,on reflection,my reference to "perks" was misguided. When we joined in 1994 we enjoyed;free valet parking;full clean on points quicker than now,and on trash and tidy day the beds were changed!;towels replenished whenever we needed;unreserved pool hopping-seasons or specific pools;we also had the option of calling for extra coffee,tea ect. which actually we thought was def. a step too far and should need to be paid for!,but none the less it was available to others-we are never looking for a free ride! I could go on but feel sure you get my gist.These are what I was refering to in my earlier post,and having read the curt replies realised my mistake in considering them perks.Non the less they have disapperared and detract from the "Disney" experience for us. Lastly, pool hopping for us is BIG. Having used Disney hotels and then DVC for 30 odd years now, we seldom-if ever-go into the parks. Our time at WDW and DC is spent lazing by the pools,shopping,and using the resort restaurants in the evening.We therefore miss the variety of pools with the constant limitations impossed by DVC. From our observations at Christmas when we have NEVER seen a pool that is anywhere near capacity(far too cold) we wonder why!! it's restricted.P.S. never have never will want or need DDP.

Why do you beleive that the holiday pool hopping restrictions are imposed by DVC? Even the original SAB and AKV restriction would have been imposed by Disney Resorts, as AKV did not have a DVC component when the AKV restriction was originally imposed. I would venture to guess they are imposed by Disney Resorts. DVC would have no particular interest in imposing pool hopping restriction to cash resorts, like the Poly or Grand Floridian, but Disney Resorts would. DVC resorts were never actually designed to allow pool hopping, as our contracts state that use of the recreational facilities is not granted to members by virtue of our ownership (ie no unlimited day use for lcoal area owners), but by virtue of our staying at the resort. I'm actually a little surprised pool hopping is still offered at all, given modern security concerns.

I don't think we were ever supposed to actually receive fresh sheets on Trash & Tidy day, sometimes we would, sometimes we would not, it varied. Otherwise there would have been no point in specifically designating it as anything other than a full housekeeping day.

While you may not like losing the the free valet perk, it really is hard to complain about losing something that was granted as a courtesy by an outside vendor and not funded by dues. Remember that if it is eventually dues funded, that SSR, OKW and offsite owners would likely not pay into the funding...as dues are tied to actual operational expenses at a particular resort. I doubt they could legally justify owners that do not have the service at their home resort paying into it. It certainly could no be considered a resort expense or even a common management item at resorts that don;t offer the service.

 

[Dean]

That idea could also work against the member. My favorite perk is the $100 AP discount. That was not there when I bought. So if perks had to remain the same as the time purchased, I would not have that.

Valet was free for everyone when I bought, so it was not listed as a DVC perk.

Not only would it likely mean no access to any possible future perks as you might see if DVC had VIP plans, as Chuck pointed out, it'd almost certainly mean the end of any such perks that were not contractual because it would be impossible to guarantee such perks going forward.

I've got no complaints about the perks we do and don't get. Disappointments maybe, but no complaints.

However, I do think it ridiculous we aren't told how our money is spent by the company we hire to run the resorts for us. If we are paying for ME, it shouldn't be a secret.

You are entitled to the info that DVCMC spends but not anything else including the resort budgets or DVC and this includes exchange contracts. Often you must present yourself in person with an appointment to get much of the info. I'm not very knowledgeable about how ME is paid but my recollection is there was a % of the expense that was passed on to resort management including in the transportation realm but not all, that it was essentially a shared expense. Hopefully someone knows for sure and can be more specific about this exact issue.

Gosh, I have obviously aroused deep feelings! Actually,on reflection,my reference to "perks" was misguided. When we joined in 1994 we enjoyed;free valet parking;full clean on points quicker than now,and on trash and tidy day the beds were changed!;towels replenished whenever we needed;unreserved pool hopping-seasons or specific pools;we also had the option of calling for extra coffee,tea ect. which actually we thought was def. a step too far and should need to be paid for!,but none the less it was available to others-we are never looking for a free ride! I could go on but feel sure you get my gist.These are what I was refering to in my earlier post,and having read the curt replies realised my mistake in considering them perks.Non the less they have disapperared and detract from the "Disney" experience for us. Lastly, pool hopping for us is BIG. Having used Disney hotels and then DVC for 30 odd years now, we seldom-if ever-go into the parks. Our time at WDW and DC is spent lazing by the pools,shopping,and using the resort restaurants in the evening.We therefore miss the variety of pools with the constant limitations impossed by DVC. From our observations at Christmas when we have NEVER seen a pool that is anywhere near capacity(far too cold) we wonder why!! it's restricted.P.S. never have never will want or need DDP.

IF you've been a member 16 years, there were no DVC resorts with valet parking when you joined. This didn't come along until 1996 with BWV. At the time ALL valet parking at Disney resorts was free if I understand correctly, this changed for every one else where they had to pay some time ago. Also, the full cleaning on points was the same other than the relative timing for a stay 8 nights or longer.

Certainly there have been changes. No more special check in desk for members, no more cloth colored napkins, print shower curtains, etc. None of these are really material issues but more emotional ones, IMO. While there have ben changes, the basics are still really the same, home resort priority, banking options (minor variations), etc. You should expect PH to become more and more restricted and to eventually be eliminated.

 

[linney94]

Why do you beleive that the holiday pool hopping restrictions are imposed by DVC? Even the original SAB and AKV restriction would have been imposed by Disney Resorts, as AKV did not have a DVC component when the AKV restriction was originally imposed. I would venture to guess they are imposed by Disney Resorts. DVC would have no particular interest in imposing pool hopping restriction to cash resorts, like the Poly or Grand Floridian, but Disney Resorts would. DVC resorts were never actually designed to allow pool hopping, as our contracts state that use of the recreational facilities is not granted to members by virtue of our ownership (ie no unlimited day use for lcoal area owners), but by virtue of our staying at the resort. I'm actually a little surprised pool hopping is still offered at all, given modern security concerns.

I don't think we were ever supposed to actually receive fresh sheets on Trash & Tidy day, sometimes we would, sometimes we would not, it varied. Otherwise there would have been no point in specifically designating it as anything other than a full housekeeping day.

While you may not like losing the the free valet perk, it really is hard to complain about losing something that was granted as a courtesy by an outside vendor and not funded by dues. Remember that if it is eventually dues funded, that SSR, OKW and offsite owners would likely not pay into the funding...as dues are tied to actual operational expenses at a particular resort. I doubt they could legally justify owners that do not have the service at their home resort paying into it. It certainly could no be considered a resort expense or even a common management item at resorts that don;t offer the service.

Why would I not beleive that "pool hopping" restrictions were imposed by DVC? I certianly do not have or need your obvious in depth knowledge, I was merely joing in on discussion, as a DVC member with a personal opinion of how my holiday experience is changing.As for security questions-all Disney resort/hotels are to my knowledge fully open to the guests that are using the parks!-of course NOT the POOLS-and as such they are able to wander within the hotels,restaurants,gift shops ect. ect.The valet parking issue, again,how would I know that this was a "courtesy" from the resort? and not from DVC?Reading these last few replies I am now thinking that we come from very different corners. We purchased DVC to continue to experience great holidays with and without our extended family for many years to come.We have mostly achieved this,but the small print in the huge "offering Statement" would never have been a huge priority of ours.We trust anything that has Disney involved! I will now begin to "Plough" through it! Thank-you.

 

[linney94]

Not only would it likely mean no access to any possible future perks as you might see if DVC had VIP plans, as Chuck pointed out, it'd almost certainly mean the end of any such perks that were not contractual because it would be impossible to guarantee such perks going forward.

You are entitled to the info that DVCMC spends but not anything else including the resort budgets or DVC and this includes exchange contracts. Often you must present yourself in person with an appointment to get much of the info. I'm not very knowledgeable about how ME is paid but my recollection is there was a % of the expense that was passed on to resort management including in the transportation realm but not all, that it was essentially a shared expense. Hopefully someone knows for sure and can be more specific about this exact issue.

IF you've been a member 16 years, there were no DVC resorts with valet parking when you joined. This didn't come along until 1996 with BWV. At the time ALL valet parking at Disney resorts was free if I understand correctly, this changed for every one else where they had to pay some time ago. Also, the full cleaning on points was the same other than the relative timing for a stay 8 nights or longer.

Certainly there have been changes. No more special check in desk for members, no more cloth colored napkins, print shower curtains, etc. None of these are really material issues but more emotional ones, IMO. While there have ben changes, the basics are still really the same, home resort priority, banking options (minor variations), etc. You should expect PH to become more and more restricted and to eventually be eliminated.

Just noted the emphasis on "IF". I apologise for forgetting that 16 years ago that we could not valet park until 1996.When we began using our points we always had a minimum stay of 14 nights-air travel involved-and full clean and trash and tidy windows were different.We now use our points differently and as such rather than wait for full clean pay to have this done.DVC member since 1994!

 

[Dean]

Just noted the emphasis on "IF". I apologise for forgetting that 16 years ago that we could not valet park until 1996.When we began using our points we always had a minimum stay of 14 nights-air travel involved-and full clean and trash and tidy windows were different.We now use our points differently and as such rather than wait for full clean pay to have this done.DVC member since 1994!

IIRC, the only real difference in the housekeeping and trash/towel was the relative timing, not the frequency or number of nights required. T/T was a more robust service early on and was called Trash & Tidy.

Why would I not beleive that "pool hopping" restrictions were imposed by DVC? I certianly do not have or need your obvious in depth knowledge, I was merely joing in on discussion, as a DVC member with a personal opinion of how my holiday experience is changing.As for security questions-all Disney resort/hotels are to my knowledge fully open to the guests that are using the parks!-of course NOT the POOLS-and as such they are able to wander within the hotels,restaurants,gift shops ect. ect.The valet parking issue, again,how would I know that this was a "courtesy" from the resort? and not from DVC?Reading these last few replies I am now thinking that we come from very different corners. We purchased DVC to continue to experience great holidays with and without our extended family for many years to come.We have mostly achieved this,but the small print in the huge "offering Statement" would never have been a huge priority of ours.We trust anything that has Disney involved! I will now begin to "Plough" through it! Thank-you.

The PH was restricted based on the volume/capacity for BC/YC and for the high demand times and based on minimizing the number people floating around the resort at AKL that were not staying there from a pool and general experience POV. Ultimately the notification of the members, and the enforcement and management to a degree, falls to DVC. I'm sure there were discussion/negotiations that likely included removing all PH as a one option. My interpretation has always been that the restrictions were DVC's way of trying to save the program rather than a DVC initiated reduction of PH. If any new resorts are built at the deluxe resorts, I suspect PH will not be included and that the entire resort would be removed as a PH option. You really should read the POS, it's actually best to do so before buying.

While buying a timeshare constitutes a certain amount of trust even if you read and understand all the legal offerings, just going on trust alone is a risky approach. If nothing else your view of what the expectations are and the companies view of what they're providing may be different.

As for the expectation that DVC should have told you it was a free courtesy, there was no need for several reasons. It didn't matter until the issue came up with this round of valet negotiations. I'm sure you knew, or should have known, that the options/perks not provided for legally could go away at any time on a whim. Even the portions controlled legally can all change, MOST without member input.

I know people who assumed everything told to them by the timeshare company was true, that it was complete and that it could not change. The timeshare sales people call them .....sucker, patsy, an easy mark, etc.

 

[DVCPAT]

As for the expectation that DVC should have told you it was a free courtesy, there was no need for several reasons. It didn't matter until the issue came up with this round of valet negotiations. I'm sure you knew, or should have known, that the options/perks not provided for legally could go away at any time on a whim. Even the portions controlled legally can all change, MOST without member input.

I know people who assumed everything told to them by the timeshare company was true, that it was complete and that it could not change. The timeshare sales people call them .....sucker, patsy, an easy mark, etc.

Do you think the guests vacationing at WDW were suckers when they awoke the following morning after the policy change and charged a $12.00 valet fee? I know notifying members is not in the agreement and would have cost money, but it seems Disney’s view of customers has changed over the years.

 

[Dean]

Do you think the guests vacationing at WDW were suckers when they awoke the following morning after the policy change and charged a $12.00 valet fee? I know notifying members is not in the agreement and would have cost money, but it seems Disney’s view of customers has changed over the years.

If they met the specific criteria I presented above, maybe so. However, I'm clearly on record in this thread as stating that's not the way I would have done it. I went on to say that I felt DVC should have handled it better in notification and should have considered a SHORT period where they did pay for it in transition, maybe 2 weeks.

 

[Chuck S]

Just noted the emphasis on "IF". I apologise for forgetting that 16 years ago that we could not valet park until 1996.When we began using our points we always had a minimum stay of 14 nights-air travel involved-and full clean and trash and tidy windows were different.We now use our points differently and as such rather than wait for full clean pay to have this done.DVC member since 1994!

DVC Member since 1992. The housekeeping windows have always been every 4 days, whether for Trash & Towel or Full cleaning. The only change that may have occurred was giving the full cleaning at 4 days when staying 8 nights or more, it may have been a Trash & Tidy and then the full cleaning. But, as Dean notes, the interval has always been 4 days. They did used to tidy a bit more, some housekeepers still do if they have the time, but fresh sheets were not a normal part of the Trash & Tidy service. IIRC, they simply used to make the beds, and maybe run the vacuum a little, which they no longer regularly do on T&T day.

 

[Glamis]

ME, like any other option, needs to be evaluated on it's own merit and a decision made somewhat independent of the valet question.

No it doesn't. If the issue is total cost, ME can certainly be evaluated compared to the valet parking. I brought it up in response to the people who fly saying "who cares about valet parking."

The point is it is pretty easy to nonchalantly not care about OTHER people losing benefits YOU don't use. But then it is a whole different issue if YOUR favorite benefit is threatened.

That's why I raised the issue of ME. People who fly use ME. People who drive use valet parking. One group of people got screwed. The other group of people still get their freebie.

That isn't fair at all.

This is not Disney getting away with anything but rather DVCMC making a decision about a specific issue that went from free to $12 per day per car.

It is definitely Disney getting away with something. They are giving us less for our money. It is that simple. Dues are extremely high. They should be adding benefits, not removing them.

The choices they had was to either raise dues so others would directly pay for the usage of those that did use it OR to do pay to play. Given those choices, there really is only ONE choice IMO.

Sure there is: don't raise dues and don't remove benefits. If they want to make money, stop giving away free meal plans that screw paying customers out of a chance at reservations.

The bottom line in this case is simply who's going to pay for something that only a small percent of people use,

If it is such a small percentage, then the cost was minimal and thus didn't need to be removed. If it was a large enough number of people for the cost to be noticeable, then that means it was a benefit that people used and deserved to retain. Either way, it should not have been removed.

 

[Glamis]

I was just in New Orleans last week - stayed at a hotel in the French Quarter on business. Valet parking was $30 a day and there was no self parking anywhere close by. If you did find self parking it was about $24 a day.

Did you pay tens of thousands of dollars, and another few hundred/thousand dollars a year to own part of that hotel?

If not, then this really isn't comparable.

 

[Glamis]

Why would any company settle for an average of $3 per car when they could earn $12 per vehicle?

When the alternative is $0 per car because you don't have the contract in the first place.

Unfortunately most valet parking attendants will tell you that--as a whole--DVC members are notoriously poor tippers.

Is there any factual data to back this up? There isn't a group of tipped employees anywhere that doesn't complain ENDLESSLY about tips. Everyone's a bad tipper to a tipped employee who thinks every other customer should be Bill Gates stuffing $100 bills into everyone's pockets.

 

[Chuck S]

No it doesn't. If the issue is total cost, ME can certainly be evaluated compared to the valet parking. I brought it up in response to the people who fly saying "who cares about valet parking."

The point is it is pretty easy to nonchalantly not care about OTHER people losing benefits YOU don't use. But then it is a whole different issue if YOUR favorite benefit is threatened.

That's why I raised the issue of ME. People who fly use ME. People who drive use valet parking. One group of people got screwed. The other group of people still get their freebie.

That isn't fair at all.


It is definitely Disney getting away with something. They are giving us less for our money. It is that simple. Dues are extremely high. They should be adding benefits, not removing them.



Sure there is: don't raise dues and don't remove benefits. If they want to make money, stop giving away free meal plans that screw paying customers out of a chance at reservations.




If it is such a small percentage, then the cost was minimal and thus didn't need to be removed. If it was a large enough number of people for the cost to be noticeable, then that means it was a benefit that people used and deserved to retain. Either way, it should not have been removed.

Except that free valet was never funded by dues, it was funded by the contractor. Before that, it was funded by Disney as valet was free for all Resort guests. So the onsite cash guests lost the perk before DVC did.

ME may, or may not, be funded by dues. As dues didn't take a large hike when ME was introduced, I think ME may not be dues funded, either. If it is dues funded, I have no problem going to "pay to play" with ME for DVCers. But I suspect it is easier to just provide ME, as some folks would simply rent a discounted cash room at a value for their arrival and departure day, then have luggage services transfer the luggage between resorts to use free ME, just as some have done to get "free" dining.

Again, if the contractor feels he is making $ by not funding DVC Parking, why would he choose to do so? Evidently his balance sheet looks OK, or they could have immediately started offering a discounted rate to DVCers, and avoided a lot of this flack. Probably because the savings incurred by not having the additional employees more than outstripped any possible return on offering a substantial discount.

Funny, we see a lot of posts about how DVC is treated poorly compared to cash guests, but then we they do treat us exactly the same (cash guests, not even concierge guests, get free valet) then there are still complaints.

 

[DaveH]

I find some of this interesting. We bought at VWL in 2001. I was of the under standing that we were paying for valet in our dues. I thought it was part of the shared expenses for the hotel. I am not sure if they had started charging for valet yet at WL. I know before DVC valet was free for resort guests. I am assuming(I know bad thing) Magical Express is built into the transportation budgets of all resorts like the busses. I think DVC as whole is causing allot of hard feelings in the membership with the poor way they announce anything but sales for buying new points. I also notice that Disney as a whole not just DVC is this way. We are empty nesters and it is just the 2 of us. Before ME we used town cars, now use ME. If ME stops soon or start charging, depending on the cost we will go back to town cars. We would be at least be disappointed but not a deal breaker. I have used valet with rental cars and the couple of times we drove to WDW.

 

[Simba's Mom]

Except that free valet was never funded by dues, it was funded by the contractor.

Again, if the contractor feels he is making $ by not funding DVC Parking, why would he choose to do so? Evidently his balance sheet looks OK, or they could have immediately started offering a discounted rate to DVCers, and avoided a lot of this flack.

But at some point, as you said yourself, free valet WAS funded by the contractor. So then why did the contractor choose to do so initially, I wonder? And so why did the contractor abruptly (or maybe it was DVC that abruptly notified us) stop? Did he somehow feel he needed to "hook" the DVC members in (is this how, as you said, the contractor felt he would be making money in the long run?) This is what I don't understand-the why of starting the free valet and then the why of stopping.