New AP rate Program is AWFUL!!

[nasmith]

Just My Humble Opinion of course -- and I've already written WDW.......My biggest concern is the 120 day advance booking and the NON-REFUNDABLE deposit! This will make it next to impossible for me to use (even though I go 4 - 6 times per year) due to the fact that My and my DHs careers require some flexibility in our travel plans!!

The copy below, detailing the new program, is from www.Mousesavers.com....

A new "Passholder Best Rate Program" has been rolled out as of June 17, 2005 that will affect Annual Passholder resort reservations for check-ins starting October 8, 2005. Many aspects of this new program are unclear and there are currently no discounts released past October 4.

The new rules for Passholder Best Rate Program reservations for October 8 and later include:

Annual Passholder rates will only be bookable online (individuals can book themselves through disneyworld.com/passholders and travel agents can book their clients thorough the Disney travel agents web site).

You must book AT LEAST 120 days in advance.

A NONREFUNDABLE deposit of one night's room rate and tax is required at the time of booking.

The Passholder can now book only ONE room (formerly it was up to 3) and the Passholder must be an adult.
Ostensibly the Passholder Best Rate Program guarantees that Passholders will receive the "best room rate offered to the general public" (not including group rates, auction rates or rates conditioned on group/club memberships or other specified eligibility requirements) at that time for the room and nights booked. If Disney subsequently reduces the room rate "to the general public" for the same room and nights you booked online under this program, they will supposedly "automatically reduce your room rate to match that lower rate."

The new program raises many issues:

The "Best Rate Program" supposedly is available from 10/8/05 through 11/26/05 or 12/19/05 (depending on which source you consult). However, no discounts are currently showing up when you try to book any of those dates. I don't know if discounts are coming soon, or not at all.

This leaves the Annual Passholder in a quandry: do you plunk down a nonrefundable deposit on your room reservation and hope that a discount becomes available later?

The situation is especially confusing for someone who already has the AAA room-only discount, since if they book the "Best Rate Program" right now they'll lose the AAA discount, but maybe they'll get a deeper Annual Pass discount later. Or maybe not.

It's unknown what "offered to the general public" means, exactly. Since many of the room discounts that have been offered in 2005 have come through private e-mails and postcards and have required a PIN code, one assumes those may not count as "general public" offers. AAA discounts would certainly fall into the category of "conditioned on group/club membership." In fact, there have been NO "general public" discounts on hotel rooms so far in 2005.

Since you can only book this program online, and a current, activated Annual Pass is required in order to access the online booking, it appears that you'll no longer be able to book the Annual Pass rate until you purchase and activate an Annual Pass. That means first-time Annual Passholders won't be able to use the Best Rate Program unless they are willing to activate the pass 3 months in advance!

 

[drp4video]

I so agree with you. This is awful. My AP's expire August 8, and I do not intend to renew them with this plan in place. It seems all you will get is a gen. rate for a room, no more AP discount. I can get a better rate them with AAA.

The convenience of just going to the parks for a morning or afternoon will be over, but I guess I can live with that. AP holders are really getting screwed.

 

[PatHill]

I totally understand!!! We live only 90 miles from WDW and go every 2 months for a weekend and stay for a week every summer at the W.Lodge . Sometimes we decided at the last moment to go to WDW for the weekend so we can not always plan a trip 120 days out. I hope these rumors turn out to be incorrect. If not I know who I will be contacting at Disney Guest Relations.....

 

[gingermommy94]

Wow...DH and I were just debating on whether or not to get AP's. If this program is what it seems, I think Disney already made the decision for us

 

[TDC Nala]

It sounds awful. But it's not even clear what it means yet. They haven't said it's the only way for AP holders to book rooms.

 

[Stitch Inside]

Sounds fishy.
Looks like we'll be at the Swan or Dolphin in December.

 

[snod911]

I really think we ought to try and get as many passholders as possible to call in on the passholder hotline first thing Monday morning to express displeasure at this ridiculous turn of events. Nothing like totally alienating one's most loyal and regular customers who've regularly demonstrated willingness to spend large sums of money to come back time and again! Who's the rocket scientist who came up with this program, anyway?

 

[mickeysaver]

If ever I thought of really buying an AP to try to squeeze in a couple of trips a year or more, this new plan has killed it. Maggie

 

[Nik's Mom]

I just bought ap's in May. I can tell you that we won't be renewing based on this new system. It just doesn't seem to be worth it. Oh well, back to going every 2 years.

 

[Suzanne74]

I am actually SO annoyed I bought an AP this in May. I did get a good discount then but this next trip, the MYW free dining was a better option, so I am not utilizing the discount (although I can hold onto my 8 day pass that I purchased so other non-APers in the room could get 8 days.) Now I was planning a small weekend trip in Dec hoping for a great AP rate and utilizinf leftover hoppers my family have an my AP. I don't think I will be using it if this is the way it is and now I sorta feel like my AP wasn't worth what I thought it would be?

Having to book 120 days out with an activated AP is crazy

I am curious to see how this plays out and how the late fall rates will lool.

By the way - they never offer flat room rate discounts to the general public anymore - always packages, few days for free, this free dining program. So how do they justify that????

 

[Sammie]

I am actually SO annoyed I bought an AP this in May. I did get a good discount then but this next trip, the MYW free dining was a better option, so I am not utilizing the discount (although I can hold onto my 8 day pass that I purchased so other non-APers in the room could get 8 days.) Now I was planning a small weekend trip in Dec hoping for a great AP rate and utilizinf leftover hoppers my family have an my AP. I don't think I will be using it if this is the way it is and now I sorta feel like my AP wasn't worth what I thought it would be?

Having to book 120 days out with an activated AP is crazy

I am curious to see how this plays out and how the late fall rates will lool.

By the way - they never offer flat room rate discounts to the general public anymore - always packages, few days for free, this free dining program. So how do they justify that????

I think something many forget Disney is a business and in business to make money. If they can fill their resorts at rack rate there is no reason to offer huge discounts to the public. I know it is very hard for those that frequent these forums, but many do book at rack rate and don't have a problem with that.

The Annual Pass was always intended to provide unlimited admission to the parks. Anything else was a bonus. Since Disney is still offering unlimited admission to all parks, year round, I see no reason to be upset about anything.

I am sure we have all gotten spoiled by the discounts of the past few years. But Disney used to not offer many discounts at all. This may have been before some of you even started going. The more lucrative discounts of recent years were due to a slump in travel. Disney need to book these rooms. That is not the case now, bookings are way up.

This program also addresses some problems Disney has experienced in the past with the Annual Pass program and an easy way to fix it, without having to confront the guest after the fact.

One; now everyone must have an adult pass to book a discount. This is has been a hot topic of discussion on this forum before.

Two, you must have a pass to actually book a discount. Personally I think this has been a long time coming. I am sure many, due to info shared on these forums, booked an AP rate and never bought one. I mean how many times have we seen people post here, "They never checked to even see if I had an AP",

Three the problems caused by people who booked multiple rooms in "hopes" of a discount. These activities have contributed to these changes.

So Disney is not the enemy, Disney just finally fixed the problem. If they see this program is losing them money, then it will be adjusted. If not it will stay and someone else will book those rooms.

 

[Susiesnowflake]

It may partially fix a problem, but it also appears to be alienating valid AP holders who visit at length or multiple times during the year. They may not be paying rack rate, if they are lucky enough to get an AP discount on their room, but they are spending lots of money on those lengthy and multiple trips a year. Yes, Disney is a business and wants to make money. They also need to recognize where a lot of that money is coming from!

 

[disneyjunkie]

I think something many forget Disney is a business and in business to make money. If they can fill their resorts at rack rate there is no reason to offer huge discounts to the public. I know it is very hard for those that frequent these forums, but many do book at rack rate and don't have a problem with that.

The Annual Pass was always intended to provide unlimited admission to the parks. Anything else was a bonus. Since Disney is still offering unlimited admission to all parks, year round, I see no reason to be upset about anything.

I am sure we have all gotten spoiled by the discounts of the past few years. But Disney used to not offer many discounts at all. This may have been before some of you even started going. The more lucrative discounts of recent years were due to a slump in travel. Disney need to book these rooms. That is not the case now, bookings are way up.

This program also addresses some problems Disney has experienced in the past with the Annual Pass program and an easy way to fix it, without having to confront the guest after the fact.

One; now everyone must have an adult pass to book a discount. This is has been a hot topic of discussion on this forum before.

Two, you must have a pass to actually book a discount. Personally I think this has been a long time coming. I am sure many, due to info shared on these forums, booked an AP rate and never bought one. I mean how many times have we seen people post here, "They never checked to even see if I had an AP",

Three the problems caused by people who booked multiple rooms in "hopes" of a discount. These activities have contributed to these changes.

So Disney is not the enemy, Disney just finally fixed the problem. If they see this program is losing them money, then it will be adjusted. If not it will stay and someone else will book those rooms.

Great post

 

[TLinden16]

No where does it say that you can't call and book AP rates within the 120 day window if they are available. If you look on the passholder website, it says this program is for people who book a few months in advance:

Planning a vacation in a few months? Then it's time to try our Passholder Best Rate Program! Now Passholders booking a Disney Resort room online under the Passholder Best Rate Program at disneyworld.com/passholders can rest easy knowing they have received our best room rate offered to the general public* at that time for the room and nights booked. And, if we subsequently reduce our room rate to the general public for the same room and nights you booked online under this Program, we will automatically reduce your room rate to match that lower rate.

It doesn't say anything about not being able to book within that 120 window if there are rooms available. To me, this program looks like away for those of us who do book a room in advance and look to apply codes at a later rate to book our room and not worry about making those phone calls when the codes are released.

I think people will still have the opportunity to make those last minute reservations by phone if they are available.

Karen

 

[cobbler]

T-
If you try to do it less than 120 days out it won't let you.

 

[TLinden16]

Cobbler, that is because the website is designed for people who are booking at least 120 days out. It's not for people who are trying to book within that 120 day window. If there are AP rates available, it doesn't say that you can't call to get them.

Karen

 

[WDWBetsy]

I guess I see it as this: you're paying for an AP for the purpose of getting paid park admission for the year. Disney is not trying to sell these passes as a room discount card. That idea is something that is promoted through discussion boards. An AP is simply so you can:

From the Disney World website:
Enjoy 365 days of magic. Annual passholders can come and go as they please through all four Theme Parks for an entire year.

Yes, they say you get benefits with the pass. But all the literature I have seen is that the periodic room discounts MAY be offered.

I agree that many are used to the discounts of the past few years - which were offered to fill the rooms during the travel slump. If a resort isn't having a problem filling those rooms, they don't offer discounts. Supply and demand - simple as that.

For those who have only bought the AP for the sole purpose of saving money on their resort stay with the discount, you might not get your original idea of your money's worth. I have seen many posts on the DIS where someone is encouraged to buy an AP to save money on their room "when the AP rates come out" - resulting in pre-conceived notions of year-round discounts being born in the minds of those reading the posts. Yes, historically they have offered discounts, but remember since 2001 the travel industry has been hurting and it is now in a better state.

It's not about Disney being mean to their loyal AP holders. It's about them offering a product (the AP) which also provides benefits - some of which are periodic. If they choose to change their program to eliminate some of the loopholes that some have taken advantage of or to have some restrictions, that is their right.

Again - I see the AP as a park pass, not a room discount card.

Just my two cents.

 

[jwfla422]

Sounds to me like WDW is discouraging buying APs with these new "rules"... But, brings me to say, that once again...(like back in the mid 90s) WDW just dumps on it's supporters who helped keep their business afloat during the rough years (in many cases the AP holders and FL residents).

If the AP is just a "park pass" what's the point in having it?? Then just buy a park hopper or whatever pass suits your visit...when we first starting buying AP's (FL resident APs) the point was the "perks" and the $$ you save by having one...that was their promotion.

It's too bad that some bad apples have encouraged them to change the rules (quite frankly I think it's a $$ issue) AND I'd like to add that now they consider these rates CLEARANCE rates. This was just not true before as there were many times that you would try to book a room and the AP rates were sold out...and only the more expensive rates were available.

Go ahead and flame me, but when things are slow for WDW, we, the AP holders & the FL residents/locals are many of the "very" guests who support them. We've had APs (off & on) for years and back in the early 90s during some very "bad" times for WDW we were there supporting them to only have the resort rates triple in price as soon as things starting going well. Business?? What happened to good business and taking care of those who take care of you through the rough times, many times WDW just doesn't see this which is a real shame.

This was one of the main reasons for us looking further into staying at the S/D during this time which quite frankly was a good thing for us because we discovered how wonderful these resorts were along with their great CMs!! and since we've been staying here almost exclusively.

So the moral is we can complain about it or find a way around it. I'm good at complaining but I do try to find a solution that works best for us...after all we're Disney Fanatics, so we gotta find a way around the corporate gunk so we can enjoy what it is really all about.

 

[BCV23]

I guess I see it as this: you're paying for an AP for the purpose of getting paid park admission for the year. Disney is not trying to sell these passes as a room discount card. That idea is something that is promoted through discussion boards. An AP is simply so you can:

From the Disney World website:
Enjoy 365 days of magic. Annual passholders can come and go as they please through all four Theme Parks for an entire year.

Yes, they say you get benefits with the pass. But all the literature I have seen is that the periodic room discounts MAY be offered.

I agree that many are used to the discounts of the past few years - which were offered to fill the rooms during the travel slump. If a resort isn't having a problem filling those rooms, they don't offer discounts. Supply and demand - simple as that.

For those who have only bought the AP for the sole purpose of saving money on their resort stay with the discount, you might not get your original idea of your money's worth. I have seen many posts on the DIS where someone is encouraged to buy an AP to save money on their room "when the AP rates come out" - resulting in pre-conceived notions of year-round discounts being born in the minds of those reading the posts. Yes, historically they have offered discounts, but remember since 2001 the travel industry has been hurting and it is now in a better state.

It's not about Disney being mean to their loyal AP holders. It's about them offering a product (the AP) which also provides benefits - some of which are periodic. If they choose to change their program to eliminate some of the loopholes that some have taken advantage of or to have some restrictions, that is their right.

Again - I see the AP as a park pass, not a room discount card.

Just my two cents.

Very well put!

 

[Gary M]

I don't think I like the new AP room discount system, but I can see what WDW is doing concerning the 120 day advance reservations and the deposit not returned. In the past people book a room at a resort at the rack rate and don't plan on keeping the room unless the AP discount comes out. This new system should stop this kind of speculation. You now book the room that you are willing to pay rack rate for, hoping for the AP discount. If you aren't willing to pay rack rate and the AP dosesn't come out, you give-up your deposit. The one room for an adult reservation also make sense for WDW.

If this system doesn't work for us, then hello Vegas, New Orleans. etc.. As long as room bookings are up at WDW, they don't care if they have our 3 to 4 trips a year and rack rate room prices are out of the question for me. We do like WDW, but only have AP's because we go 3 to 4 times a year to Disney and we go those number of times because of the AP discounts.