Miami area condo collapse

[izzy]

But that's how you feel - it's not really fair to tell others how they should feel about a situation, is it? For me, the people are already dead, and while it was a horrible death, there is nothing to be done to save them (I'm thinking those that were trapped alive have passed by now) But if the animals in the standing building are still alive, why not try to save them? They were trapped in there by humans, not by their own free will, and now we are going to just let them die.

So you want to put other peoples’ lives at risk to save these animals?

 

[JimMIA]

Well, they demolished the remaining part of the building last night at about 10:30 PM.

Apparently the demolition was done so well that rescue crews were back working within 20 minutes, according to the fire department. They worked through the night and recovered 3 more bodies, bringing the total to 27.

One thing I wanted to recognize is that we have had a lot more rescuers than just the Florida, Mexico, and Israeli teams. I've seen pictures of crews from Indiana, Pennsylvania, and Illinois, and I'm sure there are other states contributing to the rescue effort.

 

[neverlandsky]

More important than ever for everyone to please put together an evacuation backpack filled with important documents/a few keepsake pics/external jump drives. Read that the remaining residents weren't allowed to retrieve these items once evacuated.

 

[JimMIA]

Read that the remaining residents weren't allowed to retrieve these items once evacuated.

That's correct. Once something like this happens -- even a fire in a building -- nobody is allowed back into the building until authorities are satisfied that it is safe to return. The scene is completely sealed off and nobody is allowed in. In this case it never was safe to return.

In this particular situation in Surfside, members of the search and rescue teams have been collecting keepsake type articles and turning them over to the police department since the first day. Miami-Dade Police has an entire operation set up to receive the articles from rescuers, log them setting up accountability for what was recovered and where it is, and they also created a web portal where survivors and families can review the police records and claim items. All of the items recovered are evidence, and are treated exactly like evidence in a criminal trial would be treated, with a complete chain of custody maintained.

 

[KayKayJS]

" Some residents and animal welfare advocates had expressed concerned about the fate of pets left behind in the partially collapsed tower and the demolishing of the structure. But there are no animals remaning in the building, mayor of Miami-Dade County Daniella Levine Cava said during a news conference Sunday evening.
"As an animal lover and a pet owner myself my entire life, I have made it a priority since day one to do absolutely everything possible to search for any animals that may still in the building. And in the days since the collapse, the Miami-Dade Fire Rescue Team has conducted three full sweeps of the place, including searching in closets, under beds, and all the other places that they could to see an animal that might have been in hiding … The latest information we have is that there are no animals, remaining in the building," Levine Cava said. "

Found this on ABC news

 

[luvthatduke]

That's correct. Once something like this happens -- even a fire in a building -- nobody is allowed back into the building until authorities are satisfied that it is safe to return. The scene is completely sealed off and nobody is allowed in. In this case it never was safe to return.

In this particular situation in Surfside, members of the search and rescue teams have been collecting keepsake type articles and turning them over to the police department since the first day. Miami-Dade Police has an entire operation set up to receive the articles from rescuers, log them setting up accountability for what was recovered and where it is, and they also created a web portal where survivors and families can review the police records and claim items. All of the items recovered are evidence, and are treated exactly like evidence in a criminal trial would be treated, with a complete chain of custody maintained.

I'm so glad to read this.
There is a gentleman who wishes he had grabbed a painting of his mother.
He was one of the first people to be briefly interviewed right after.
I pray he gets it, intact.
I pray everyone gets important things back.

 

[DisneyOma]

So you want to put other peoples’ lives at risk to save these animals?

If they choose to do so, then yes. Just like people choose to risk their lives doing a bunch of other things like climbing Mt Everest, rock climbing, etc. I'd rather risk my life to save another living thing than climb a mountain just to say I did it.

 

[MamaMermaid]

My husband is currently mourning his best friend that he’s known since he was a child (completely unrelated to this). His left behind a wife and a young son. It is shocking to me that someone would compare that grief to someone who left behind their cat or be sad for animals but not people. It’s sad that those animals will most likely perish. It’s sad that they’re probably hungry, thirsty, and frightened. They will be missed by their owners. It is not the same. That little boy would much rather have lost a dog than his dad.

Agreed. It sucks these poor animals have died - no one is discounting that. No one here hates animals and wants to see them suffer/die, etc. But, at the end of the day, human lives are greater than animal ones. (and for those who disagree, that's fine. We can have different opinions)

So sorry @PlainJane for your hubby's loss. I lost my dad unexpectedly last May to a massive heart attack. I'm 30 and am struggling; I can't imagine the pain of that little boy.

 

[barkley]

More important than ever for everyone to please put together an evacuation backpack filled with important documents/a few keepsake pics/external jump drives. Read that the remaining residents weren't allowed to retrieve these items once evacuated.

i wouldn't suggest keeping important documents in an evac backpack. these are items that can be used to steal one's identity so they should be safeguarded. we keep one set in our home safe in a quick to grab folder, we keep another-and these include the original copies of certain items like car/home titles, physical savings bonds, certified copies of vital docs-in a safety deposit box at our bank. this way if we have to evacuate and can't get to our home (fires now are closing off areas and people at work can't get in to grab anything) we will still have access. in the past when we've traveled out of the country and i wanted to be prepared 'just in case' i've scanned ours/our then minor children's photo id's, birth certs, our health insurance cards and a piece of paper with the name/contact number/policy number for our insurance company and created a file. i attach the file to an email and send the email to both mine and dh's cell phone. if an emergency presents itself i've got accessible information that i can print out as well.

 

[Disneyfan754321]

i wouldn't suggest keeping important documents in an evac backpack. these are items that can be used to steal one's identity so they should be safeguarded. we keep one set in our home safe in a quick to grab folder, we keep another-and these include the original copies of certain items like car/home titles, physical savings bonds, certified copies of vital docs-in a safety deposit box at our bank. this way if we have to evacuate and can't get to our home (fires now are closing off areas and people at work can't get in to grab anything) we will still have access. in the past when we've traveled out of the country and i wanted to be prepared 'just in case' i've scanned ours/our then minor children's photo id's, birth certs, our health insurance cards and a piece of paper with the name/contact number/policy number for our insurance company and created a file. i attach the file to an email and send the email to both mine and dh's cell phone. if an emergency presents itself i've got accessible information that i can print out as well.

They have people on site collecting items that are found and tagging them, they hope to find owners of important things at a later date.
I live in South Florida many of us have "go" bags with important stuff that we grab in a hurricane. It is possible some other people grabbed there's when fleeing.

 

[barkley]

They have people on site collecting items that are found and tagging them, they hope to find owners of important things at a later date.
I live in South Florida many of us have "go" bags with important stuff that we grab in a hurricane. It is possible some other people grabbed there's when fleeing.

we had them when we lived in earthquake country, now it's b/c of wildfires where we live but i still don't want vital documents or a zip drive with access to all of it just sitting out in the open.

 

[JimMIA]

We got a couple of rain bands from Tropical Storm Elsa, with lightning, that caused very brief interruptions in the search effort last night. Despite those short breaks, rescuers are making much better progress than they could earlier. One more body was recovered yesterday evening and four more last night.

So the death toll now stands at 32. There are at least 113 people missing.

The mayor said that, of those missing, at least 70 have been confirmed as having been inside the building when it collapsed. Police are still trying to contact families to firmly establish who was inside the building and who was not, but they have not been able to reach some families. It's reasonable to assume that police do not have DNA samples from families of those 40+ people they've been unable to contact. She said some of the families only provided partial information on the missing persons, which also complicates identification.

I'm also not clear on the missing number. At one point the sum of the located bodies and "missing" added up to around 160. As the search progressed however, the missing number dropped about 15 more than the death toll increased. I don't know (and it has not been disclosed) whether that is due to "human remains" or learning that some people counted as missing were actually not inside the building and were safe.

 

[PollyannaMom]

...or learning that some people counted as missing were actually not inside the building and were safe.

I assumed that was the case as well - figuring there were some people who were away that night and just hadn't mentioned it to anyone.

I was really hoping there would be a lot of those at first, but the longer it's on the news without anyone coming forward to say they saw their own building on TV, the less I think they'll find any more in that position.

 

[Skywalker]

If they choose to do so, then yes. Just like people choose to risk their lives doing a bunch of other things like climbing Mt Everest, rock climbing, etc. I'd rather risk my life to save another living thing than climb a mountain just to say I did it.

I think it'd be risky to give someone permission to go into a dangerous situation like that, even if they wanted to. I can imagine if the worst happened, how quickly their families would be filing lawsuits. Even if they signed some kind of waiver, the family could claim their loved one was not in a rational state of mind at the time due to grief or whatever. People ruin everything.

 

[JimMIA]

I think it'd be risky to give someone permission to go into a dangerous situation like that, even if they wanted to. I can imagine if the worst happened, how quickly their families would be filing lawsuits. Even if they signed some kind of waiver, the family could claim their loved one was not in a rational state of mind at the time due to grief or whatever. People ruin everything.

The risk is not lawsuits. Allowing someone to enter an unsafe building would also put rescuer lives at risk.

If a person were allowed to enter -- and either got in trouble or didn't come out when expected -- rescuers would have to go into the building and search for them.

There is no way rescuers would just say, "Oh well...we told them not to go back in, and we have this waiver signed!"

They would be forced to go in, and that is an unacceptable risk to any emergency manager.

 

[JimMIA]

Quick update from this afternoon's update.

Four more bodies were recovered after the morning briefing, bringing the total number of known deceased to 36. There are approximately 109 people still missing.

 

[PlainJane]

Agreed. It sucks these poor animals have died - no one is discounting that. No one here hates animals and wants to see them suffer/die, etc. But, at the end of the day, human lives are greater than animal ones. (and for those who disagree, that's fine. We can have different opinions)

So sorry @PlainJane for your hubby's loss. I lost my dad unexpectedly last May to a massive heart attack. I'm 30 and am struggling; I can't imagine the pain of that little boy.

Thank you. My husband is coping pretty well because we're Christians and his friend was a Christian, so we have hope we'll see each other again. I think the hard part is that because their friendship was so long, it's like he lost a part of himself. I can't imagine what it must be like for his widow and little boy. He's so young that she has to explain again and again that "Daddy is in heaven." That must be crushing for him and her.

I'm so sorry for your loss. I'm sorry it was during such a chaotic and isolating time on top of it. I pray God gives you comfort and peace.

 

[Dan Murphy]

From what I've read in the last day or is that the rescuers were very confident that their were no animals, who were still alive, in the building before it was brought down.

 

[izzy]

If they choose to do so, then yes. Just like people choose to risk their lives doing a bunch of other things like climbing Mt Everest, rock climbing, etc. I'd rather risk my life to save another living thing than climb a mountain just to say I did it.

But they aren’t just potentially risking their lives. What if a volunteer animal rescuer goes in there and gets in trouble? Now someone has to go in and try to rescue that person.

Trust me, I love animals, but I don’t think others peoples’ lives should be put at risk to save them. I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[JimMIA]

10 more victims were recovered overnight, raising the total to 46. The number of missing has been reduced to 94.

Officials say the operation remains a search and rescue effort, but it's been two weeks and they have not found anyone alive since the first few minutes. The chances of anyone alive in the rubble appear to be very slim.