Why Treat AP Holder Worse than non-AP Holders?

[lllovell]

Oh! I didn't know you could still get the AP rate the other way, too. I was REALLY wondering what to do about my Dec trip, 2nd & 3rd we are staying at a non DVC resort and I was hoping for a good rate. We might stay at GF if I can get one! (for MIL & Christmas decorations) But, since I won't pick up my AP until Sept trip, and it will be 80 days then between trips, I was afraid I was out of luck completely. Now I can just wait and see if one comes out, then call and book it if I can. Right??? I won't have to have the AP in my hand that way.

Lori

This one is still not 100% either way Lori. If you go ahead and sign up for the dates at the hotel you want, you will get a discount NOW if one is available and it will be discounted more if something changes in the future. There is some question as to if any extra AP rates will be released at all (but obviously if the hotel is not full they will do what they need to in order to fill the rooms), but this way, if you get a "discount" now on those nights, you know the maximum it will cost you.

 

[gullyf]

Oh! I didn't know you could still get the AP rate the other way, too. I was REALLY wondering what to do about my Dec trip, 2nd & 3rd we are staying at a non DVC resort and I was hoping for a good rate. We might stay at GF if I can get one! (for MIL & Christmas decorations) But, since I won't pick up my AP until Sept trip, and it will be 80 days then between trips, I was afraid I was out of luck completely. Now I can just wait and see if one comes out, then call and book it if I can. Right??? I won't have to have the AP in my hand that way.
Lori

Unfortunately, it would appear that the jury is still out on this one. No one, including Disney management (at least at the levels that people seem to be dealing with), really seems to be quite sure. All in all, I am not impressed with how this appears to have been handled. And I really have a hard time believing that the imagineers were called in to simulate an environment of ineptitude

 

[Sammie]

This is probably all true. But if tourism is picking up again, who can blame them? Disney will set their prices at whatever the market will bear. If they have trouble selling rooms, the discounts will come back - if there's no vacancy, then we've probably seen the end of discounts.

Similarly, if nobody renews their AP's you may see Disney revert back to the old AP discount system. Then again, if Disney continues to fill its parks and sell its rooms, even in the absence of their old AP customers, then the AP program may dry up entirely. Why should disney care if its parks are filled with people who come once a month or with people who come once every 3 years, as long as the parks are full?

Agree with you completely.

I know it seems to hurt some feelings that Disney would replace them with another paying guest; but it is a business. As you stated as long as the rooms fill up it does not matter who fills them.

If enough people do not use the program and it fails, Disney will try something else. I just do not see that happening though. Already some of the naysayers are booking theirs using this program just as fast as their fingers can type.

 

[lllovell]

Well lets keep in mind that generally discounts don't COST Disney anything. Like any hotel or cruise ship, an usold room is what costs money. So even if you have to give a huge discount to fill a room (or a themepark), it is still better than making nothing at all on an empty room.

We know WDW has had trouble filling rooms in the past 5 years, hence the discounts both AP and otherwise. My guess is the changes to discounts we're witnessing are indicative of fewer empty rooms.

Another guess I would have is this - that 5% is probably a large percent of their profits. I have no idea what the profit margin is in the entertainment industry, but 5% of any business is worth keeping, right?

How do cash discounts off goods and services not cost them money?

If I were supposed to pay $75 a ticket for Cirq and now I can get those same tickets for 56.25, then it just cost them 18.75 per ticket. I do understand that this is a way of making sure the arena is filled for each show the same as AP rates are a way of keeping the hotels full.

Same for a dining discount (especially DDE which gives you 20% off both meals and alcohol). If I am supposed to pay $100 for a meal and instead pay $80, isn't that costing them $20?

Also, you are kinda making my point for me. If the AP holders matter (bread and butter kinda group) then they will keep pushing the program. If AP holders were not causing an increase in the bottom line, they would be stopping all discounts, not adding a couple of sizeable ones this past year alone. I am one of those that doesn't see the new AP program as a way of discontinuing the AP discounts. I see it as a cost effective way to fill as many if not more hotel rooms.

 

[lllovell]

Agree with you completely.

I know it seems to hurt some feelings that Disney would replace them with another paying guest; but it is a business. As you stated as long as the rooms fill up it does not matter who fills them.

This is true as long as the people filling the rooms are spending money at the parks as well. (and restaurants, DTD, etc). What we don't have are figures, so everything is opinions, but there has to be a reason to give bigger and better discounts (again - who knows about the AP room discount program at this point...but they certainly could have said "no more" and been done with it if they weren't concerned with losing the AP owner's business all together).

 

[lillygator]

How do cash discounts off goods and services not cost them money?


Same for a dining discount (especially DDE which gives you 20% off both meals and alcohol). If I am supposed to pay $100 for a meal and instead pay $80, isn't that costing them $20?

Oh my, one example.....have you ever seen the wine prices and then compared them to the same bottles of wine in the stores? Look at what you pay for a chicken or pasta dinner at any of the sit down restaurants...They mark food and alcohol prices WAY up...20% is not costing them anything when it comes to dining....now the ticket part I don't know about....


eta* and having that 20% off has gotten us to try many new sit down, more expensive restaurants thus spending more money....

 

[lllovell]

Oh my, one example.....have you ever seen the wine prices and then compared them to the same bottles of wine in the stores? Look at what you pay for a chicken or pasta dinner at any of the sit down restaurants...They mark food and alcohol prices WAY up...20% is not costing them anything when it comes to dining....now the ticket part I don't know about....


eta* and having that 20% off has gotten us to try many new sit down, more expensive restaurants thus spending more money....

no no - I get that and know that the mark up is huge on services like restaurant food and drinks (I mean what can a fountain Coke cost? $0.10 MAYBE?) My point though is that they are giving up $20 of profit on this end to get more people in the restaurants, right? So, how can it be a bad decision to give up $20-30 a night profit to AP holders to get them at the parks, stores and restaurants to spend more money? $20 profit given up here to make $30 more makes sense to me, but it is STILL costing them $20 upfront that they might not make back. So, there has to be information that tells them we will spend more if they get us back on property.

 

[BostonRob]

Are you implying that AP holders spend more money once they're actually in WDW than other guests?

 

[lillygator]

what??

 

[lllovell]

Are you implying that AP holders spend more money once they're actually in WDW than other guests?

Over the course of a year - yes I am (since the break even point is 10-12 days right? not including discounts)

However, if Disney could fill those rooms with new guests each time, I am sure that a good many of them spend more than my family on souvineers and if they were paying rack rates, then they would also pay more than I do for rooms (typically). So, if that was the case, the would no longer court AP holders.

That said - who do you think fills the parks during the long months between school starting back and school ending each year? I don't have any hard numbers here (and I have looked when all of this came up) but I am willing to bet its more AP holders than not. Especially Florida Resident AP holders. Obviously, there are more AP discounts to be had during "off peak" times to attract those people like us DISers that are Disney nuts. If the visitation was balanced throughout the year, they probably wouldn't cater to AP holders as much as they do now either.

Such as it is, I bought my AP to get into the parks cheaper than paying daily. Any and all extra perks I get are just that - - - perks. If I have to jump through the occasional hoop to get my perk, then I have to decide if the perk is worth it to my family. As with any new program, it won't fit everyone's needs, but I think this one will fit most people's needs when it settles a bit and the internet feeding frenzy stops.