Tiered Benefits

[jcf]

I was in a focus group last month for DVC. They paid me $100 to talk about what we would want in a tiered program. We had to rate the top three items we wanted on a list. They included. Dedication reservation line. Free entry to water parks, bigger discounts at parks, free cabana rental per stay, free TIWC, extra room cleaning. and a few more I can't remember right now. We were told everyone in our group would be in the top tier.. I have 600 points...

I wonder if you talked to the other people to see how many points they had? 400-600 top tier?

Did they say when?

 

[drusba]

I was in a focus group last month for DVC. They paid me $100 to talk about what we would want in a tiered program. We had to rate the top three items we wanted on a list. They included. Dedication reservation line. Free entry to water parks, bigger discounts at parks, free cabana rental per stay, free TIWC, extra room cleaning. and a few more I can't remember right now. We were told everyone in our group would be in the top tier.. I have 600 points...

Nope it is not on the list: unlimited fast passes. I asume by TIWC you mean a Tables in Wonderland card. Makes you wonder if the new DVC TIW card is going to be the introduction of tiered benefits with the annual price being lower for high point owners.

 

[dr&momto2boys]

Since we have 450 points, if the tiered benefits were worth it we could be enticed to buy at least another 150 more. I'm betting they'll have to be direct purchases too, not resale. Hmmm...I wonder if we buy resale now if they may be included in this tiered benefit program. We were thinking about buying more points soon anyway.

BTW, I'm not in favor of tiered benefits. I dislike paid fast pass/ front of the line programs and the like. Even so, if they do offer it we will likely buy more points sooner than later.

 

[tjkraz]

I doubt the program benefits will be substantial enough to prompt a member to immediately buy 200-300 additional points. However, it seems logical that only direct purchase points would contribute toward the necessary threshold. If that's the case, the program stands as one more proverbial knife in the back of the resale market.

Let's say the threshold is 500 points. A member with 400 qualifying points who is looking to add-on could have a pretty good incentive to buy more direct. Even an educated member who is aware of resale savings stands to gain 30-50 years worth of added perks in return for spending a couple thousand dollars more up-front.

And it gives the sales staff one more direct purchase benefit to float to prospects who are on the fence.

Additionally, when Jim Lewis first floated the idea he stated that new business referred by current members would also contribute toward participation. If that concept remains, it gives members a reason to mobilize and become more vocal about the benefits of DVC--particularly if members in the states which cannot receive cash rewards are eligible. Perhaps 250 points owned plus 250 points referred will be sufficient for participation.

 

[Brian Noble]

I doubt the program benefits will be substantial enough to prompt a rational member to immediately buy 200-300 additional points.

Fixed that for you.

More seriously: people place high value on little things like this all the time. A big chunk of Wyndham's business model is built on it.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

This is my thinking. I do think we will see another "grandfather" of resales points purchased after March 20, 2011 towards the tiered point amounts. Then resales purchased going forward would not be grandfathered. Too many people have purchased resales since March 2011 not to have their points included in the new tiered points system. JMHO.

Since we have 450 points, if the tiered benefits were worth it we could be enticed to buy at least another 150 more. I'm betting they'll have to be direct purchases too, not resale. Hmmm...I wonder if we buy resale now if they may be included in this tiered benefit program. We were thinking about buying more points soon anyway.

BTW, I'm not in favor of tiered benefits. I dislike paid fast pass/ front of the line programs and the like. Even so, if they do offer it we will likely buy more points sooner than later.

 

[Dean]

Whether such a program will happen or whether it will be enough for those in the know to buy additional points depends on the specifics. One thing is for certain, EVERYONE has their point where they would buy additional retail points if they could afford it.

This is my thinking. I do think we will see another "grandfather" of resales points purchased after March 20, 2011 towards the tiered point amounts. Then resales purchased going forward would not be grandfathered. Too many people have purchased resales since March 2011 not to have their points included in the new tiered points system. JMHO.

I don't think there's ANY chance of having multiple level of memberships related to grandfathering, at least within DVC itself. I think it's a certainty that any changes going forward that negatively affect usage of DVC resale points will affect those that bought after 20 March but before the change in question the same as those who buy after any future change. The only exception I can think of is if there were to be a DVC II that were technically and legally separate from the current DVC. I think it's possible we'll see a future option to qualify resale points that are currently not qualified as part of a min additional retail purcahase.

BTW, I'm not in favor of tiered benefits. I dislike paid fast pass/ front of the line programs and the like. Even so, if they do offer it we will likely buy more points sooner than later.

I think most members would agree with you, myself included. However, these type of deals are everywhere from many local restaurants to airlines to most timeshares. I've seen members here on DIS so against such a program that they state they could never participate in any company who did such things. That is unrealistic as the only way to avoid them completely would be to give up all modern conveniences and move to the woods.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

I don't think there's ANY chance of having multiple level of memberships related to grandfathering, at least within DVC itself. I think it's a certainty that any changes going forward that negatively affect usage of DVC resale points will affect those that bought after 20 March but before the change in question the same as those who buy after any future change. The only exception I can think of is if there were to be a DVC II that were technically and legally separate from the current DVC. I think it's possible we'll see a future option to qualify resale points that are currently not qualified as part of a min additional retail purcahase.

A few months ago I would have agreed. Not so sure now. ABD and DCL really aren't at the core of DVC. RCI is still included in the post 3/20/2011 resale purchases. Why exclude these points if the new program will encourage mor point purchases? Of course additional points will have to be direct. Excluding resales points up to this point doesn't make financial sense. Nothing gained by doing this. It will be interesting to see the direction this takes.

 

[Dean]

A few months ago I would have agreed. Not so sure now. ABD and DCL really aren't at the core of DVC. RCI is still included in the post 3/20/2011 resale purchases. Why exclude these points if the new program will encourage mor point purchases? Of course additional points will have to be direct. Excluding resales points up to this point doesn't make financial sense. Nothing gained by doing this. It will be interesting to see the direction this takes.

RCI exchange is a benefit that's core to the timeshare portion, I don't think they can take that away. DVC has a history of dabbling, whether it's off property options or this change his past March. The question is whether they have the stomach for coming up with a differentiation that has teeth. That will not include locking out RCI and likely not BVTC either. It will be interesting to see if anything comes of this. If they do proceed I'm thinking a dedicated reservation line, more liberal banking/borrowing/transfer rules and points to pay for due/tickets/DDP/etc are leading candidates.

 

[Sammie]

We can afford extra points, but honestly I can not think of anything they could offer to make us want more than we have.

 

[Deb & Bill]

We can afford extra points, but honestly I can not think of anything they could offer to make us want more than we have.

Exactly. We'll sell more contracts before we buy any more.

 

[Dean]

We can afford extra points, but honestly I can not think of anything they could offer to make us want more than we have.

There is a point where EVERY member would add on if they could afford it. Whether they'll offer enough incentives to reach that point for many members remains to be seen.

 

[wulfekamp]

I really don't like the idea of this. We have always been just DVC members. It didn't matter if you had just a few points or thousands we were all the same. Now because I don't own a bunch of points I'm second class and don't deserve what the richer members would get. I see a lot of hurt feelings ahead if this happens. I love DVC but would sell if I'm made to feel second class. My wife and I are empty nesters and are not going to add on.

 

[Anal Annie]

My cousin asked me for our guides name & number a couple of years ago...feeling it was my duty to offer her THE BEST deal possible I also gave her the website address for the Timeshare Store & explained how her money would go so much further on the resale market. They ended up finding the perfect contract and saved THOUSANDS over what WE paid direct a few years earlier...and this was long enough ago that they're grandfathered in with the changes that were made last year. I cannot recommend direct sales to anyone that I LIKE!!

Guess we won't be cashing in on any perks or benefits that are referral based....

 

[disneydawn6]

I wonder if you talked to the other people to see how many points they had? 400-600 top tier?

Did they say when?

I only talked to one other who had 1000 points. Most everyone was against the tiered system idea and told the moderator in no uncertain terms... They just said they were thinking about it.

 

[DVC Dude]

With the Disney price so high and resales so low, there is NO perk they can offer me that would make up the difference in price.

 

[keishashadow]

More seriously: people place high value on little things like this all the time. A big chunk of Wyndham's business model is built on it.

DVC members identify so closely with the brand, likely a contingent out there who would would drink the kool aid and add on direct if only for the cache of being 'more' elite...the supercalifragilistic among us? lol I'll pass but would like to think perhaps buying spurts would help things overall for DVC.

 

[Greysword]

One aspect of this is true value someone places on their money versus the value of the product they are buying and company they are supporting.

There is no question buying resale is a good value from a dollar savings standpoint. If the same benefits can be purchased at a lower price point, then it makes sense to buy through resale. However, if the benefits are no longer equal, the true value of the product comes into question. If the financial value of the added perks are equal or greater than the amount spent, the extra dollars are worth it.

The question at this point becomes, what is the dollar value of this perk? This is subjective, as the amount could be calculated using something gained or something not lost. For instance, the current perk of using points for the Disney collection could be calculated using the cash cost of a points reserved DCL stateroom, while the perk of reserving a room at a DLR hotel could provide a benefit from expiring points.

The other half is the value of money, itself. Some people are more flamboyant with their money, while others are very frugal. As you know, these personality traits can manifest regardless of economic condition of the person in question. The rich can be penny pincers, while the poor can throw money around like it is endless. On another hand, the fatalistic will spend more quickly than those who plan to be around for a long time. While most of us are somewhere in the middle, it does effect our perception of how we spend.

A third factor not directly related to value is loyalty. Some people will pay a higher price to support a business they like, and this is a huge economic factor in capitalism. In fact, it is truly the only real vote we have. Some people will pay more for the a shirt at a mom & pop tailor or niche clothing store downtown, while others buy from big box department stores, as a third person will only buy from a discount store (WalMart/Ross/TJMax, etc). Many times, this is not perpetuated by the actual cost of the item, rather they want to support a specific business and keep them open. This can be seen in brand loyalty of cars (GM vs Ford, vs Toyota) or amusement parks (Universal vs Disney). To this segment, the price isn't as important as perpetuating the existing environment and helping a business stay liquid.

Any tiered program DVC implements will play directly into these aspects, and the balance shift from resale to direct would be fairly easy to tip.

For me, there is only one factor that would cause me to buy resale, and that is product availability. We are very happy with VGC and BLT, and likely the only future add-ons will be for these resorts (unless they do a new resort at DLR, then we may switch over completely to have all of our points in one place). I will only wait so long for DVD to find the right point contract to match my UY and desired point load, then I will seriously consider buying resale (especially if the right contract is available right now). Otherwise, I will advocate to buy direct. This is due to my balance in the matrix listed above.
- I have reaped the value of the current perks offered to direct buyers.
- I am of the mind that I should spend my excess money, while I'm around to enjoy it without jeopardizing my family's economic stability (now or in the future).
- I support Disney and the DVC, and I want to encourage them to remain focused on their loyal constituency.

 

[Sammie]

There is a point where EVERY member would add on if they could afford it. Whether they'll offer enough incentives to reach that point for many members remains to be seen.

I am obviously not understanding your point, which is usual I guess.

There is literally nothing they could offer as an incentive that would cause us to add on.

We have more than enough points for our needs. So no there is nothing they can offer that would change that.

We will not be adding on, ever. It is not about being able to afford it, it simply is a case of we don't want it. I really do not understand your comment.

I can afford many things that I do not buy and more DVC points are in that category. There are many times I feel we have too many, why would I possibly want more.

 

[Anal Annie]

With the Disney price so high and resales so low, there is NO perk they can offer me that would make up the difference in price.

I agree - it would have to be a real WHOPPER of a perk IF we were to ever afford an add-on. We purchased direct in 2006 thru a Friends & Family deal - got $15 off per point & paid $86 / pp at SSR and at the time it seemed a fair deal. Of course that's before the economy tanked and everybody started ditching their timeshares. ANYWAY, the current SSR resales are running in the low $60's. In doing some simple math, taking $62 as an average resale price that is $24 less than what we paid. That would be $6,000 less than what we paid for our 250 points. For approx. the same money at todays prices we could purchase an additional 100 points. That's HUGE. I simply cannot see DVC offering any perks or benefits that could equal $6,000 as enough incentive to purchase a significant amount of points directly (unless it's DEEPLY discounted AP's for life or something like that. Not just $100 off but more like 50% off prices for AP's).

But if they set the minimum ownership too high for ANY additional perks it would feel like a snub to those of us living on a budget and who are "points challenged". I really hope this is just more rumors.