Have we reached Peak Pricing at WDW?

[tigertides]

It's no secret that WDW crowds have lulled. May be the heat, post-pandemic spending cuts, etc.

But I can not help but wonder... after more than a decade of price increases...

Have we reached peak WDW prices?

Are consumers (old and new) simply fed up with price hikes? Has Disney wrung out every last penny from MCU, Star Wars, ESPN, Theme Park add-ons? etc?

This got me thinking... YES
https://www.wsj.com/articles/disney...edia-woke-politics-florida-inflation-791a6ad1

 

[Eastern]

I'm sure there are still people who are happy to pay the price but it's not me.

I cancelled D+ and booked a standard view room. My version of economizing.

 

[DanceDisney23]

Only time will tell. I will cancel our Disney+ subscription when it expires later this year. We’re looking into Dollywood for next year followed by Universal in 2025 when Epic Universe opens.

That being said, I looked into some other destinations for next summer, and everything seems hideously expensive right now. I think travel in general has reached a peak.

 

[disneysteve]

What do you mean a decade of price increases. Try 5 decades. Prices have gone up regularly since the park opened in 1971. Have prices peaked? No. That will never happen. Prices will always continue to rise. The rate and magnitude of increases will vary but prices will always keep rising.

 

[Minnie1222]

I'm still unfazed after 3 decades.

 

[tvguy]

Not sure we have reached the peak. Disney knows from past experience that when things are less crowded at WDW, people spend more, to the point that Disney makes more money overall than if they had more people in the parks.

 

[tzolkin]

What do you mean a decade of price increases. Try 5 decades. Prices have gone up regularly since the park opened in 1971.

Prices always increase with inflation, but they have increased at a much more drastic rate in the last decade.

For our last family Disney trip (2019) the ticket prices alone ($2400) were more than the cost of our entire on-site trips from years prior. I actually just looked on the website and the current price for the exact same tickets is $4600, so nearly double in 5 years. And, I looked at my email confirmations and 10 years ago I spent $1018 on the same tickets. That's approaching 5 times the price in just 10 years.

We used to do an 8-12 night trip every year and of course prices increased a bit each year, but the last few felt like dramatic leaps in pricing (where the cost did not match the experience) so we have not gone back.

 

[Pinnochio]

If it wasn't for the return of AP's, i would have reduced my trips down to one per year instead of 3.....so i was almost fed up with the increases, but they pulled me back in ....

 

[HopperFan]

If it wasn't for the return of AP's, i would have reduced my trips down to one per year instead of 3.....so i was almost fed up with the increases, but they pulled me back in ....

Same. We would be looking for those FL Magic tickets or the 4 Day tickets for an annual trip like we did up until 2006 when DS was no longer in school. We switched to the big boy AP with 4-6 visits a year to "get our monies worth". Now we have the Pixie Pass and I am comfortable if we do just 3-4 trips.

But we have still shifted what we spend, rather than increase spending. Genie+ means next to no TS.

 

[crisi]

What do you mean a decade of price increases. Try 5 decades. Prices have gone up regularly since the park opened in 1971. Have prices peaked? No. That will never happen. Prices will always continue to rise. The rate and magnitude of increases will vary but prices will always keep rising.

Inflation at the very least will see to that. The question is probably "will Disney's price increases be more on pace with inflation in the future" - and that itself is doubtful because Disney will need to continue to invest in its theme parks, and pricing will need to reflect that.

Additionally, Disney theme parks have a supply demand problem - supply - how many people you can fit in the parks - is limited without expensive additional gates. Demand, with population increasing and international travel, has outpaced its supply. The econ 101 answer to this problem is to continue to raise prices

 

[Anthony1971]

In the past when numbers were low Disney started with the new lowest price ticket ever…. It was if you bought a 10 day. They offered buy 5 days get 2 free of your entire package and like. Prices will not go down but for a week it might as a promotion. The idea is not to have day guests it is to get people to stay at Disney resort make them happy and relaxed…... then fleece them.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

No Disney prices will continue to go up each year.

When times are slow they’ll offer great deals.

I remember amazing trips in the 2008-20011 time frame. Buy 4/Get 3 free plus gift cards and FD packages.

 

[chalee94]

Inflation at the very least will see to that. The question is probably "will Disney's price increases be more on pace with inflation in the future" - and that itself is doubtful because Disney will need to continue to invest in its theme parks, and pricing will need to reflect that.

Additionally, Disney theme parks have a supply demand problem - supply - how many people you can fit in the parks - is limited without expensive additional gates. Demand, with population increasing and international travel, has outpaced its supply. The econ 101 answer to this problem is to continue to raise prices

A few years ago, I would have agreed. Not as sure now.

Here you mention that "Demand, with population increasing and international travel, has outpaced its supply. " I think elsewhere you posted that the demographics of the population are changing, such that younger people don't have the same connections to old Peter Pan movies and such and aren't generally as interested in a Disney vacation as that age group was in the past.

Certainly, politics is becoming a factor more than we can discuss here but on one side, some people express fear of traveling to FL or supporting the leadership with their vacation spending, and on the other side, some people don't want to support Disney's politics (or even have friends and family ask them if they support that.)

Certainly, those who believe in climate change are going to have a demand shift related to central FL travel plans in the summer and hurricane season in general.

Inflation has people spending more on groceries and credit card debt is over $1T. Borrowing costs are up. More companies (at least in my limited reading) appear to be considering layoffs. That will hurt demand in the near term.

I'm not saying we'll see a pullback to 2001 or 2008 levels, but a measurable softening of demand with consistent discounting is definitely a possibility.

 

[SleepyDeb]

For me, the price isn't as much of a deal breaker as the complexity of a day in the park now. In January, the alphabet soup of LL, ILL, etc just killed the fun. I may change my mind tomorrow, but no plans to go back to WDW right now.

 

[Miffy]

Same. We would be looking for those FL Magic tickets or the 4 Day tickets for an annual trip like we did up until 2006 when DS was no longer in school. We switched to the big boy AP with 4-6 visits a year to "get our monies worth". Now we have the Pixie Pass and I am comfortable if we do just 3-4 trips.

But we have still shifted what we spend, rather than increase spending. Genie+ means next to no TS.

I hear you. G+ means we stay Mod, not Deluxe, and make the most out of our popcorn bucket refills.

 

[crisi]

A few years ago, I would have agreed. Not as sure now.

Here you mention that "Demand, with population increasing and international travel, has outpaced its supply. " I think elsewhere you posted that the demographics of the population are changing, such that younger people don't have the same connections to old Peter Pan movies and such and aren't generally as interested in a Disney vacation as that age group was in the past.

Certainly, politics is becoming a factor more than we can discuss here but on one side, some people express fear of traveling to FL or supporting the leadership with their vacation spending, and on the other side, some people don't want to support Disney's politics (or even have friends and family ask them if they support that.)

Certainly, those who believe in climate change are going to have a demand shift related to central FL travel plans in the summer and hurricane season in general.

Inflation has people spending more on groceries and credit card debt is over $1T. Borrowing costs are up. More companies (at least in my limited reading) appear to be considering layoffs. That will hurt demand in the near term.

I'm not saying we'll see a pullback to 2001 or 2008 levels, but a measurable softening of demand with consistent discounting is definitely a possibility.

I think demand will be hurt in the short term - which may cause Disney to back off on pricing - or may cause them to double down to get the most out of those who can pay more. But I think long term, inflationary pressure, the requirements to respond to climate change (Disney's costs to insure have had to have gone up), etc, will mean that Disney's costs will continue to increase - possibly just not at the rate they have for the short term.

Personally, I think that Disney as a corporation is happiest when their are fewer guests in the park spending more per guest than when there are a lot of guests in the park spending less per guest.

 

[Miffy]

I think demand will be hurt in the short term - which may cause Disney to back off on pricing - or may cause them to double down to get the most out of those who can pay more. But I think long term, inflationary pressure, the requirements to respond to climate change (Disney's costs to insure have had to have gone up), etc, will mean that Disney's costs will continue to increase - possibly just not at the rate they have for the short term.

Personally, I think that Disney as a corporation is happiest when their are fewer guests in the park spending more per guest than when there are a lot of guests in the park spending less per guest.

I thought this, too, but someone here on the DIS pointed out to me that Disney wants to sell food and merchandise as well, and the more guests they have, the more food and merch they sell.

Also, I can't see how it helps the brand if they price anyone who isn't a high-wage earner out of the parks. Then Disney would become just another experience that people wish they could do but that they can't actually do.

Wouldn't they run out of wealthy people at a certain point? The upper-middle-class and wealthy people I know regard WDW as a place where you begrudgingly take your kids when they're little and then--whew!--it's over with and you can forget about it forever.

No matter how much money Disney is making off onetime guests, repeat visitors make up a lot of their business. If they didn't, Disney wouldn't be selling APs, they wouldn't have bounceback offers, they'd never have room discounts, they'd raze their Value resorts, and they wouldn't bother advertising to the masses.

 

[chalee94]

Also, I can't see how it helps the brand if they price anyone who isn't a high-wage earner out of the parks. Then Disney would become just another experience that people wish they could do but that they can't actually do.

Wouldn't they run out of wealthy people at a certain point?

Well, yeah, the Galactic Starcruiser proved hubris can definitely go too far.

But I'd admit that pricing the parks and hotels in general can be more complicated.

 

[crisi]

I thought this, too, but someone here on the DIS pointed out to me that Disney wants to sell food and merchandise as well, and the more guests they have, the more food and merch they sell.

Also, I can't see how it helps the brand if they price anyone who isn't a high-wage earner out of the parks. Then Disney would become just another experience that people wish they could do but that they can't actually do.

Wouldn't they run out of wealthy people at a certain point? The upper-middle-class and wealthy people I know regard WDW as a place where you begrudgingly take your kids when they're little and then--whew!--it's over with and you can forget about it forever.

No matter how much money Disney is making off onetime guests, repeat visitors make up a lot of their business. If they didn't, Disney wouldn't be selling APs, they wouldn't have bounceback offers, they'd never have room discounts, they'd raze their Value resorts, and they wouldn't bother advertising to the masses.

In particular, they aren't really excited about the budget guests - the ones packing in food and beverages who aren't buying merchandise to start with - this much they've stated in earnings calls. Repeat visitors learn the tricks to make DVC affordable - they like those "once in a lifetime lets blow a lot of money" guests.

And there are tons of people with a lot of money - And those people continue to have new generations of kids. And even more in the "upper middle class" who will treat their kids to a trip or two to Disney - there are millions in the U.S. alone. Enough to fill Disney's parks every year without having to worry about those stretching a budget.

 

[Miffy]

In particular, they aren't really excited about the budget guests - the ones packing in food and beverages who aren't buying merchandise to start with - this much they've stated in earnings calls. Repeat visitors learn the tricks to make DVC affordable - they like those "once in a lifetime lets blow a lot of money" guests.

And there are tons of people with a lot of money - And those people continue to have new generations of kids. And even more in the "upper middle class" who will treat their kids to a trip or two to Disney - there are millions in the U.S. alone. Enough to fill Disney's parks every year without having to worry about those stretching a budget.

What will they do with the Value and Moderate resorts, though? I mean, why did they build them and why would they keep them? People with a lot of money who are having a once-in-a-lifetime trip to WDW aren't staying at Pop or the All Stars or even POR.

Right now, there are decent discounts for both resorts and park tickets available and they started selling APs again. So apparently they do want other people visiting, unless I've misunderstood something.

If the Disney parks are going to become a luxury experience only--the theme park equivalent of a $2.5 million house or a $350K car--Disney is going to end up losing a lot of customers of their other products. And I think they know this. Yes, once-in-a-lifetime visitors may spend more (although for sure there are once-in-a-lifetime visitors who are on a strict budget as well), but there's nothing like goodwill to keep a business in business.