Suggestions for dealing with school

[brockash]

I need help figuring out the best way to speak to the administration of my kids' school. Today for the second time in the last few weeks my older son was sent to the nurse for a nosebleed. The first one was somewhat of an issue because he ended up with quite a bit of blood on his shirt that they made him change it. Today's wasn't as bad and stopped almost immediately after he got to the nurse. Am I out of line for thinking that they should have contacted us to let us know that happened? Compounding the issue is that about two months ago my younger son broke his arm at school before lunch and they never contacted us about it. We knew nothing until we picked him up from latchkey and he was crying his arm hurt so much. How do I tactfully suggest to the principal and district administration that maybe they should be contacting the parents in these situations? The only time I've heard anything from them was when my older son got so overheated in gym he threw up. And that was only because I had to go pick him up.

The nose bleed thing I don't reallt think a phone call is needed. My kids got them at school and I was never contacted. The broken arm thing...sounds complicated. They must not have known ir was broken, which sucks, but happens. I do think in that situation if he went to the nurse explaining what happened and crying about it hurting they should have called you. - Does he go to the nurse often? That's the only thing I could think of as to why it was brushed off so easily, but again still a hasty decision.

I don't think you'd have any issue calling and explaining that you'd like to be contacted anytime one of your kids goes to the nurse. If it were me, I'd enail the nurse and admin. and follow up with a phone call. My guess is they'll have no issue with your request once they know about it. You have to remember the vast number of different typesof parents schools have...some hate anytime a school calls, some NEVER answer, some yell at them every time they call and then there are others who are supportive and would like the communication. I imagine once you let them know you want to ve notified, they'll start notifying you.

ETA: Just needed to edit to add that you also have the parents that want to bring an attorney to everything lol. Like I said there's just so many different types of families in one school building and their preferences go from one extreme to the other. Just let them know...I think you'll find this is an easy fix.

 

[tvguy]

One nurse for three schools, so who knows where they are at any given time.

School nurses were eliminated many years ago here in the schools. Anything requiring more than a bandaid prompts a call to 9-1-1 so paramedics are involved. They are better equipped that a nurse because they carry a full compliment of medical supplies and drugs that a school nurse wouldn't have.

 

[brockash]

My wife tries to avoid confrontation if at all possible. Even when she knows that she shouldn't. Many times I deal with it for her or can convince her she needs to. This one she would not allow me to go in and speak with them.

Latchkey is a generic term for after school childcare. At least it was in the '80s, maybe it's been replaced with something else. The YMCA sends a couple of 19 year old college students to the school to make sure 30 or so elementary school kids don't kill each other. They knew he was hurt, but didn't call because he came to them like that and told them he had been to see the nurse then sent back to class.

I have a history of getting upset and losing all tact and decorum. The words that were used in my exclamations about the school would get me kicked right off the DIS. She's pissed but so afraid of confrontation that she doesn't want a direct answer. She wants to ask some people she knows the next time she sees them in person what they think the policy is.

Yeah I don't get what there is to be confrontational about??? This is just a simple discussion and request about communication. There is NO reason to make it more than that.

And why are you both so angry/pissed tonight? Because you weren't called about the nosebleed? I really think it would be helpful to step back for a moment and just calmy email your request of being contacted anytime your child goes to the nurse.

There did not seem to be any intent of harm nor neglect really in any of your scenarios, just a misunderstanding of expectations. Like I said, in your school's population of parents you are most likely in the minority of wanting to be contacted about nosebleeds or every time your child says something hurts. There's nothing wrong with wanting to be contacted, but they just need to know that....again theres no ill-will.

 

[brockash]

School nurses were eliminated many years ago here in the schools. Anything requiring more than a bandaid prompts a call to 9-1-1 so paramedics are involved. They are better equipped that a nurse because they carry a full compliment of medical supplies and drugs that a school nurse wouldn't have.

Hmmm... who gets billed for that? Very interesting way to handle things. They must get called all the time. What was the point of getting rid of the school nurses?

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Yes. Instead of just sending a kid to the clinic with a pass the nurse had to divide the clinic into a “well” area (basically nose bleeds, cuts, etc) vs. possible COVID cases…kids who seemed feverish. The teacher had to call the clinic to alert the nurse a child was coming. Also you needed to be more picky in who you would send as you didn’t want to send someone down for a bathroom accident if you could avoid it as you didn’t want them exposed to someone with COVID.

Anytime a kid had a fever/possible COVID they were sent home. If they tested positive for COVID the nurse and principal would have to try to contract trace anyone who sat around that student. Teachers had to make a seating chart that was followed at lunch and resource classes and school busses had their own seating charts for contract tracing. It was a mess as you can imagine. They lifted mandatory masks for kids a few months ago and fir teachers maybe a month ago. I’d say probably about 40% of kids are still masking up but the clinic rules are back to the “before” time rules.

Thank you.

I was searching around trying to see if there were policies about when to notify parents about things. I didn’t have much luck. I did come across this article which I thought was post-worthy, just as food for thought:

https://www.centralmaine.com/2021/1...nts-and-school-districts-have-had-to-step-in/

I also saw this about nosebleeds. This is put out for school personnel in conjunction with the CDC:



https://rems.ed.gov/docs/WA_Injury_Illness.pdf

FWIW I do think you should’ve been notified about the arm issue but for some reason there was a breakdown in communication. I would want to know why and what the policy is for notifying parents about such things in the future. As a pp poster said, some parents want to know everything, some don’t want to know much, and most probably fall somewhere in the middle. Let them know you are the type who would like to be notified.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

School nurses were eliminated many years ago here in the schools. Anything requiring more than a bandaid prompts a call to 9-1-1 so paramedics are involved. They are better equipped that a nurse because they carry a full compliment of medical supplies and drugs that a school nurse wouldn't have.

Their roles are completely different (with no criticism of paramedics, who I think are great at what they do). A school nurse‘s role encompasses much more than first aid. Who manages the day to day health issues of students in schools?



ETA

NASN position statement: role of the school nurse​

It is the position of the National Association of School Nurses that the registered professional school nurse is the leader in the school community to oversee school health policies and programs. The school nurse serves in a pivotal role to provide expertise and oversight for the provision of school health services and promotion of health education. Using clinical knowledge and judgment, the school nurse provides health care to students and staff, performs health screenings and coordinates referrals to the medical home or private healthcare provider. The school nurse serves as a liaison between school personnel, family, community and healthcare providers to advocate for health care and a healthy school environment (National Association of School Nurses/American Nurses Association)

The school nurse has a crucial role in the seamless provision of comprehensive health services to children and youth. Increasing numbers of students enter schools with chronic health conditions that require management during the school day. This policy statement describes for pediatricians the role of the school nurse in serving as a team member in providing preventive services, early identification of problems, interventions, and referrals to foster health and educational success. To optimally care for children, preparation, ongoing education, and appropriate staffing levels of school nurses are important factors for success. Recommendations are offered to facilitate the working relationship between the school nurse and the child's medical home. This statement has been endorsed by the National Association of School Nurses.

 

[Colleen27]

Hmmm... who gets billed for that? Very interesting way to handle things. They must get called all the time. What was the point of getting rid of the school nurses?

Saving money. Few schools around me have a nurse because they just can't afford it - per pupil funding in my state is about $3000 short of keeping up with inflation over the last 30 years, and a nurse is a less painful thing to cut than teachers and programs.

Around me, 911 isn't the primary replacement. We have office staff with Red Cross first aid training as a first line response. Calling parents is the second. Emergency services are a last resort and our protocol only specifies they be called for situations involving a loss of consciousness or other serious injury requiring immediate attention. I'm only aware of one situation where 911 was called in the 9 years we've had kids at our current school and that was for a student with an open fracture of both bones in his forearm.

 

[tvguy]

Hmmm... who gets billed for that? Very interesting way to handle things. They must get called all the time. What was the point of getting rid of the school nurses?

Budget cuts. I suspect liability concerns may also have been a factor. Nobody gets billed unless there is an ambulance transport. And even with a school nurse on site, an ambulance would cost the parents the same amount whether is was requested by the school nurse or the Fire Department. . Fire Department responds for free.

 

[tvguy]

Their roles are completely different (with no criticism of paramedics, who I think are great at what they do). A school nurse‘s role encompasses much more than first aid. Who manages the day to day health issues of students in schools?

Someone in the Principals office handles administration of prescription drugs, and insulin, etc. They do have an RV that comes around to each school every year and administer eye exams and the like.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Saving money. Few schools around me have a nurse because they just can't afford it - per pupil funding in my state is about $3000 short of keeping up with inflation over the last 30 years, and a nurse is a less painful thing to cut than teachers and programs.

Around me, 911 isn't the primary replacement. We have office staff with Red Cross first aid training as a first line response. Calling parents is the second. Emergency services are a last resort and our protocol only specifies they be called for situations involving a loss of consciousness or other serious injury requiring immediate attention. I'm only aware of one situation where 911 was called in the 9 years we've had kids at our current school and that was for a student with an open fracture of both bones in his forearm.

Same situation at our school re: protocols. We have a nurse that covers 5 schools, so we get her once a week. Our office is first aid trained to handle (most of) the rest.

 

[slo]

I skimmed over the replies and I didn’t see the age of the child - did I miss that?

With my girls that are now 23 & 18, when they were in elementary school the nurse would call me to fill me in on what is happening with DD. In Middle school the nurse would call sometimes and in HS only if my DD needed to be picked up because she was sick.

In regards to the broken arm, not all breaks present themself as a break right away. If the situation didn’t appear serious right away, then the nurse can’t be blamed - IMO.

 

[amylevan]

School nurses were eliminated many years ago here in the schools. Anything requiring more than a bandaid prompts a call to 9-1-1 so paramedics are involved. They are better equipped that a nurse because they carry a full compliment of medical supplies and drugs that a school nurse wouldn't have.

I’m going to say as a parent of a kid with an epi-pen this would make me very nervous. Yes, teachers are trained but….

And my good friend has a kindergartner with diabetes. I can’t imagine her being in a school without a nurse.

So I’m glad my little school district has a nurse in each school (and since COVID an additional one just to manage the district COVID protocols and quarantine questions…)

 

[GreatLakes]

I skimmed over the replies and I didn’t see the age of the child - did I miss that?

My older son is 9 and in 3rd grade, my younger son is 6 year old kindergartener.

The kid involved is in 3rd grade.

 

[easyas123]

Yeah I don't get what there is to be confrontational about??? This is just a simple discussion and request about communication. There is NO reason to make it more than that.

And why are you both so angry/pissed tonight? Because you weren't called about the nosebleed? I really think it would be helpful to step back for a moment and just calmy email your request of being contacted anytime your child goes to the nurse.

There did not seem to be any intent of harm nor neglect really in any of your scenarios, just a misunderstanding of expectations. Like I said, in your school's population of parents you are most likely in the minority of wanting to be contacted about nosebleeds or every time your child says something hurts. There's nothing wrong with wanting to be contacted, but they just need to know that....again theres no ill-will.

I gotta say, I agree with the above posters comments.

OP - why on earth would you wait 2 months after a broken arm to address this situation? A simple call or email to clarify what happened & the protocols would have been a simple thing to do. I don't think - as per the way you described it - it was a intentional thing on the part of the school nurse/admin/teachers or whomever was in charge that day.
For what it's worth - I've had a kid break his wrist. He fell while snowboarding, said it hurt but he was okay. I even checked out his wrist and jokingly said to him that evening "it's not broken, you're fine!". He then went bowhunting the next morning. THEN he decided it "hurt a lot". X-rays showed broken...kids are strangely resilient, until they decide not to be!

 

[tzolkin]

I don't really see any reason to be angry/confrontational over this. My husband and I are both very direct, so we would certainly address these things if we had an issue but in a clear and positive manner. People are typically more receptive if the discussion is framed as "what can we do to work together/prevent this" rather than blaming or getting mad (in which case they will likely be defensive).

I don't want the nurse penalized if the procedures were followed correctly. I'd like clarification of what those procedures are.

I think you could simply have a conversation and ask what their procedures are for these types of things. That said, if you don't agree with the standard procedure you can have a discussion about modifying it.

My oldest had an accident in K or 1st grade. She came home with her clothes in a bag and different pants on. I'm sure this is a common occurrence for kids this age, so it was not the school's policy to call parents but I asked that they please do so if it ever happened again. Daughter had never had an accident except when she had a UTI, but because they didn't call (so I didn't find out until 4:30p when she got off the bus) I couldn't get her in to see the doctor until the following day.

On the opposite side, my son was prone to very severe nosebleeds. I always made his teachers and the school nurse aware of it so they would not be alarmed. With the amount of blood these would definitely have been considered call-worthy, but I didn't feel it was necessary because it was a "normal" thing for him.

In addition to talking to the school, I think it's also important to talk to your children. It sounds like your son probably did not make a big deal out of the arm injury so the teachers were not concerned enough to call or send him home. Either he wasn't in a lot of pain (in which case you can't really fault the school because you would likely not have known the arm was broken even if he was at home) or he chose to be quiet about it. If it's the latter, I would encourage him to speak up and advocate for himself if he ever has another issue like that where he knows there is something wrong.

My sister bit her tongue almost completely off when she was a kid at recess. She went the whole rest of the day, rode the bus home, and then opened her mouth to show my mom (who of course freaked out and took her to the hospital). My parents were upset, but really couldn't fault the school for not notifying them because my sister said nothing so they didn't know there was anything wrong.

 

[tvguy]

I’m going to say as a parent of a kid with an epi-pen this would make me very nervous. Yes, teachers are trained but….

And my good friend has a kindergartner with diabetes. I can’t imagine her being in a school without a nurse.

So I’m glad my little school district has a nurse in each school (and since COVID an additional one just to manage the district COVID protocols and quarantine questions…)

With Little League, that ultimately is why we were instructed to call 9-1-1. One of the Doctors talked about keeping epi-pens on site, but no way I was going to do that even with training.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

With Little League, that ultimately is why we were instructed to call 9-1-1. One of the Doctors talked about keeping epi-pens on site, but no way I was going to do that even with training.

Not doing it could be fatal for someone.

 

[DLgal]

This is absolutely unacceptable. We have an on duty school nurse and he calls us for every minor thing that happens. This is in HIGH SCHOOL, mind you.

My son was prone to nosebleeds, so this came up a couple times. Always was called.

Our schools, going back to the district preschool, have an accident slip that gets sent home if literally anything happens (bump, fall, ball to the head during PE, etc). In addition to the note, a call or email happens same day, and if it's bad enough to require medical attention, a call to pick the kid up. A fall bad enough to cause a broken arm would be a call to pick the kid up and would require clearance by a doctor before being allowed to return to normal activities at school/PE.

This school sounds really neglectful.

 

[tvguy]

Not doing it could be fatal for someone.

How would I do it? We had no way of getting epi pens......legally.......unless a parent gave us one.

 

[DisneyHardin]

How would I do it? We had no way of getting epi pens......legally.......unless a parent gave us one.

Kids that need Epi-pens should always have one with them.