Aggressive DVC Housekeeping Checkout Day

[71 Truck]

I may have missed it but with the number of people having this happen has anyone contacted member services or Disney in any way to file their concerns?

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It's either that or you get a mystery phone call where the person on the other line hangs up on you when you answer. That has happened to me multiple times (admittedly, over 25 years), INCLUDING the my stay last month. Obviously, I forgot to disconnect the phone.

Which is just nutty to me feeling like you have to. Honestly a bit creepy too to get a phone call and the person hangs up on you.

 

[robinb]

Which is just nutty to me feeling like you have to. Honestly a bit creepy too to get a phone call and the person hangs up on you.

Yes. That's one of the reasons many of us as are upset about it. What makes it worse is that it's modus operandi for DVC Housekeeping and has been happening for at least 20 years, proven by the thread I posted from 2002 complaining of the very same problem.

 

[tjkraz]

I hadn't considered that and it really does add to the challenge. That being said, Disney knows this in advance and has been at this for decades (cleaning 30-40k hotel rooms), how have they not figured it out yet?

The biggest issue is that you can't maintain a staff when you're offering 5 hour work shifts. The goal of having every room clean by 4pm puts a hard cap on how late the workers can be scheduled. You can't offer workers an 11am - 8pm shift because the DVC resorts cannot have rooms unavailable that late at night.

Most Disney housekeeping shifts start at 8am. From 8-11, they're cleaning rooms that have been vacated early. The problem is the number of rooms vacated early is unpredictable and varies from day to day. If 20% of the departing guests have left by 9am and used the app to check-out, ideally staff are routed to those locations and nobody gets a door knock. If only 2% of guests have left early, you've got your staff looking for things to keep busy, faced with the reality that they have even less time to get the required work done.

I suppose Disney could still increase staffing with the knowledge that they'll be paying workers to be non-productive if there aren't enough early departures. But that's going to impact dues.

I don't think there's a clear-cut solution for reallocating the current labor resources in a better manner. Certainly nothing that we folks on a message board can come up with, which Disney resort managers haven't considered over the years.

As a few have said, why not let the tech fix this - They have basically made the app a requirement so the large majority should have it. Send out a push the night before checkout requesting the time you expect to vacate the room. If no response, send again in the early AM. That will allow them to easily set up a staffing and cleaning plan in advance without wasting time knocking and disturbing your customers.

Those are possibilities, but the more cumbersome you make the process, the more prone to user error it will be. If you encourage people to record their departure time in advance, I think there's a very real chance most will use 11am as a default.

Plus there are limits to what you can do with this information. Even if you know by 8pm that few guests are departing early the next day, I'm not sure that managers can use that data to add additional staff on 12 hours notice.

 

[tjkraz]

Interesting insight here. The entire thread is worth a read. Note this was written in April before the MDE check out feature was introduced:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1511130910590181380

Particularly relevant for this discussion:

 

[RoseGold]

I honestly think the tool for this job might be my alarm doorstop. I haven't used the thing since I was in my 20s traveling 50% in cheap hotels. It's LOUD. Heck, even in those hotels, housekeeping didn't enter my room. You wanna barge into my room, there better be an emergency.

Honestly, we should all be a lot more concerned about people breaking into our rooms, or answering aggressive knocks. I know I would have been when I was a 20s single and didn't have a (unjustified?) sense of security from "Disney" or an expensive hotel. You have no idea who that person is. Just because someone is banging on your door like the building is on fire, doesn't mean you should answer the door.

 

[RivShore]

Those are possibilities, but the more cumbersome you make the process, the more prone to user error it will be. If you encourage people to record their departure time in advance, I think there's a very real chance most will use 11am as a default.

Plus there are limits to what you can do with this information. Even if you know by 8pm that few guests are departing early the next day, I'm not sure that managers can use that data to add additional staff on 12 hours notice.

From the customer standpoint it needs to be as simple and quick as possible - click on the push, select a time, submit. If people have navigated all the other stuff in the app during their stay, they can handle that.

I'm thinking you would get decently accurate info on departure time. For those with morning flights, they know exactly when they need to be heading to the airport, why say 11 if you have to be on the road by 9? For others with afternoon departures, chances are they will be in the room till 11.

The union contract probably defines when employees need to be notified of coming into work but addendums can always be made. Maybe create a new position that gets paid a bit more and is a floater that can be called in on 8 hours notice, once the numbers are crunched. There have to be some creative ways to eliminate the knock but when you combine inflexible union rules with a large, resistant to change, division of a large company, you get annoyed customers.

 

[RoseGold]

From that Twitter thread:

"The day after our Disney Fairytale Wedding in Epcot housekeeping at the Grand was banging on our door with the privacy sign out at 8:15. There isn’t justification for that."

Wow.

 

[tjkraz]

I'm thinking you would get decently accurate info on departure time. For those with morning flights, they know exactly when they need to be heading to the airport, why say 11 if you have to be on the road by 9? For others with afternoon departures, chances are they will be in the room till 11.

Maybe. I think any late day departure or split stay carries a high degree of uncertainty.

During our last stay at Riviera we had a 9:30 breakfast reservation at Topolino's. Our original plan was to pack most of our stuff, eat, return to grab bags and leave before 11. Turned out we were ready to go before breakfast. If asked to predict departure the night before, we would have been forced to say 11am. Turned out we were out of the room by 9:20.

Yes they could build in a bunch of features which let you change the departure time, etc. The risk is people set-and-forget. If I'd marked 11am the night before, it's completely off my radar. Instead I marked our departure while riding the elevator up to Topolino's. I think there are trade-offs with any process. The morning alert with 2-3 taps is about as simple as it can get.

If you read the twitter thread above, the former manager repeatedly emphasizes that housekeepers are supposed to respect the room occupied sign. If they aren't it's a training issue and no policy changes are necessary.

I HOPE the main takeaway from this thread is that people use the room occupied sign. (And remove it when out of the room so housekeeping knows to get in and do their work.) If the sign is ignored, by all means complain to management.

The union contract probably defines when employees need to be notified of coming into work but addendums can always be made. Maybe create a new position that gets paid a bit more and is a floater that can be called in on 8 hours notice, once the numbers are crunched. There have to be some creative ways to eliminate the knock but when you combine inflexible union rules with a large, resistant to change, division of a large company, you get annoyed customers.

None of these are ideas which would have eluded Disney managers. Respectfully, us saying "if they did 'X' things would improve" is sort of a pointless exercise. Chances are housekeeping managers either considered or actually implemented 'X' and have valid reasons for going in another direction.

 

[Matty B13]

Yes. That's one of the reasons many of us as are upset about it. What makes it worse is that it's modus operandi for DVC Housekeeping and has been happening for at least 20 years, proven by the thread I posted from 2002 complaining of the very same problem.

To bad you can't *69 the phone call......

And yes, I have had both the loud knocking and phantom phone calls at Disney Resorts not just DVC.

Sadly Disney hasn't bothered to come up with a "real" solution for this, either by their great IT management or just leaving the "do not disturb" signs in the rooms anymore.

Hence the 5 cent posted note solution.........

 

[DL1WDW2]

I’m still processing the job that lets me leave at 3:45
No wonder they are pounding the door at 8 a.m.
Wake up get out I want to be home by 4 … and get paid for extra hour . That is a great incentive .
Is this truth?

 

[SL6827]

Is this happening at resorts like SSR or OKW? The bungalows or cabins?

 

[DL1WDW2]

Realistically…I believe Disney wants to find ways to make us take a consumer survey that makes us ask for them to cutback and save us money cause it is a Topsy. Turvy DisneyWorld.
I guess I just plain think the worst of Disney and they don’t care and that is their goal.
I own DVC and want to screw Disney over as my ultimate goal.
That will be my guest satisfaction

Game on

 

[DL1WDW2]

Re-reading Post above concerning Union Contracts.
If only guests would give Disney a legal reason to eliminate Unions.
Housekeeping has a strong Union Contract with Disney and also Bus Drivers.
Their jobs Do need to be protected.
Contracts are currently being negotiated

I do respect Housekeeping and The Bus Drivers and want to show my support.

I don’t need to save a penny for every dollar
I guess Disney Pennie’s add up for Disney= $$$

 

[tjkraz]

Yes. That's one of the reasons many of us as are upset about it. What makes it worse is that it's modus operandi for DVC Housekeeping and has been happening for at least 20 years, proven by the thread I posted from 2002 complaining of the very same problem.

Phantom phone calls have never been approved or endorsed by management. They happen because individual employees take matters into their own hands. I'm not defending bad workers, but anyone who has been in a management position knows that workers do things we cannot fully predict or control. Sadly there are always bad apples.

From that Twitter thread:

"The day after our Disney Fairytale Wedding in Epcot housekeeping at the Grand was banging on our door with the privacy sign out at 8:15. There isn’t justification for that."

Wow.

Also noteworthy, the manager reiterated multiple times that housekeeping CMs are not supposed to be ignoring the room occupied sign.

Sadly Disney hasn't bothered to come up with a "real" solution for this, either by their great IT management or just leaving the "do not disturb" signs in the rooms anymore.

For all intents and purposes, the room occupied sign = do not disturb. They changed the verbiage because of the apparent need to enter rooms daily for security checks. Housekeeping CMs are supposed to respect the sign until 11am on check-out day.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The biggest issue is that you can't maintain a staff when you're offering 5 hour work shifts. The goal of having every room clean by 4pm puts a hard cap on how late the workers can be scheduled. You can't offer workers an 11am - 8pm shift because the DVC resorts cannot have rooms unavailable that late at night.

Most Disney housekeeping shifts start at 8am. From 8-11, they're cleaning rooms that have been vacated early. The problem is the number of rooms vacated early is unpredictable and varies from day to day. If 20% of the departing guests have left by 9am and used the app to check-out, ideally staff are routed to those locations and nobody gets a door knock. If only 2% of guests have left early, you've got your staff looking for things to keep busy, faced with the reality that they have even less time to get the required work done.

I suppose Disney could still increase staffing with the knowledge that they'll be paying workers to be non-productive if there aren't enough early departures. But that's going to impact dues.

I don't think there's a clear-cut solution for reallocating the current labor resources in a better manner. Certainly nothing that we folks on a message board can come up with, which Disney resort managers haven't considered over the years.


Those are possibilities, but the more cumbersome you make the process, the more prone to user error it will be. If you encourage people to record their departure time in advance, I think there's a very real chance most will use 11am as a default.

Plus there are limits to what you can do with this information. Even if you know by 8pm that few guests are departing early the next day, I'm not sure that managers can use that data to add additional staff on 12 hours notice.

Tim, you keep stating this "can't maintain staff with 5 hour work shifts" and purporting there is nothing for them to do from 8-11am if they aren't rousting people out. (ok - last bit my interpretation but it's the essence of what you state). #2 does not mean #1 is a necessity and #2 just isn't true. What does it take though - is better organization and better management. All people don't check out en-mass at 11am and it wouldn't even be that hard to use the tools they have to work in a manner that is also respectful of the guests that are leaving later in the morning.

The real problem? Disney hotels doesn't fix the issue.

It hasn't happened often to me but I've gotten the phone calls and a knock or two. My fault is that I haven't taken the time to communicate with the hotel so they are at least hearing some guests are not happy when that occurs. The phone calls were the terribly obnoxious one.

 

[Halle]

We were in a GV at the BWV in May, we didn't get the knock but we had mousekeeping parked outside our door from about 8:30 on. I told her that we would be leaving the villa at 10:30. Didn't deter her from staying there until we departed. We are that family that takes out the trash and runs the dishwasher too.

 

[lowlight]

If housekeeping is advised to respect the sign, and they aren't, and people are complaining, then it's a top down issue where management simply doesn't care. Instead of finding ways to punish guests, how about offering an incentive to DVC members? Offer a small gift card for 9 am or earlier pre-confirmed checkout on checkout day. If you value housekeepers at 20/hr, then saving 2 hours of one standing around doing nothing certainly offsets a $10 gift card. This would help with the issue of knocking on doors, and also with rooms not being available by 4 PM.

 

[RivShore]

Yes they could build in a bunch of features which let you change the departure time, etc. The risk is people set-and-forget. If I'd marked 11am the night before, it's completely off my radar. Instead I marked our departure while riding the elevator up to Topolino's. I think there are trade-offs with any process.

But the point isn't perfection, if you get 80% of the check out times close to correct you are 80% better than you have today. As long as you get enough rooms noted as early checkouts to keep people busy for 2.5 hours, you are good to go!

(And remove it when out of the room so housekeeping knows to get in and do their work.)

As I noted above, this will get forgotten more often than not because you are more worried about having all your kids and stuff packed up. It's just too easy to forget to be useful. Technology is the more reliable answer.

None of these are ideas which would have eluded Disney managers. Respectfully, us saying "if they did 'X' things would improve" is sort of a pointless exercise. Chances are housekeeping managers either considered or actually implemented 'X' and have valid reasons for going in another direction.

Agreed but that is what the internet is for, pointless pontificating LOL.

I guarantee you that current management has not thought of everything, even the obvious stuff we've mentioned here. Most departments, like housekeeping, have entrenched management that is resistant to real change and is only concerned with maintaining their little kingdom within the big kingdom. I know this from experience with many large corporate campuses, I doubt Disney is any different.

 

[tjkraz]

Tim, you keep stating this "can't maintain staff with 5 hour work shifts" and purporting there is nothing for them to do from 8-11am if they aren't rousting people out. (ok - last bit my interpretation but it's the essence of what you state).

Actually I've said repeatedly that they shouldn't be ignoring the room sign and rousting people out. And if they are, it deserves to be corrected.

People leave early and their rooms can be serviced. The issue seems to be identifying those rooms, with secondary consideration to how many are vacated early. The app check-out feature was just introduced 6 months ago. I have no idea how rapidly it rolled out to all resorts. Regardless, it's a new(ish) feature.

To be clear: If housekeepers are ignoring the room occupied sign, it's inappropriate. If Disney itself isn't making proper use of the check-out data, that's their failing. (It's pointless to introduce such a feature and then ignore the data, so I'm optimistic they are using it.)

All of those things said, it's also true that 30-40% of the housekeeping shift falls before 11am. If 30% of rooms haven't been vacated before 11am, it's a problem. Given what I know / believe to be true, there's no easy solution for cleaning 80-100% of the rooms in 70% of the work day. It starts with the guests, who are absolutely within their rights to stay until 11. Trends suggest that some people leave early. The issue is identifying those rooms. Hopefully the app is helping.

The real problem? Disney hotels doesn't fix the issue.

The new feature in the MDE app is a clear attempt to fix the issue. What we lack is context. Has the frequency of door knocks declined in the last 6 months? It certainly SHOULD have.

Nevertheless, the issue is unlikely to be eliminated in an operation the size of WDW. Especially if there is a belief that housekeeping should not be knocking on ANY doors before 11am, regardless of whether there is a sign displayed or not. There will always be people who fail to use the app to check out (or call housekeeping, or stop by the front desk, or hang a separate tag on the door that says "I'm outta here"). Those are the rooms they're currently trying to find.

It hasn't happened often to me but I've gotten the phone calls and a knock or two. My fault is that I haven't taken the time to communicate with the hotel so they are at least hearing some guests are not happy when that occurs. The phone calls were the terribly obnoxious one.

We seem to be in agreement here. Personally, I've never had a phone call. The door knocks are minimal and, to the best of my recollection, limited to times when we are moving around and have removed the occupied sign.