The Running Thread—2023

[Mr_Incr3dible]

Wait this is such a genius idea. I’m only lurking at the moment (hoping for maybe the WDW Marathon in 2025 and just did my first run in ages the other day) but I may just steal this idea from you when I finally get serious about training!

1. Kudos for getting back into running
2. Feel free to participate and not lurk
3. If you want to do 2025 marathon, be ready to sign up in March(?) of 2024. I missed seeing my reminder earlier this year, so no entry for 2024 (at this time)
4. Start training now and do some shorter races to figure out what does/doesn't work for you
5. I find it very useful and motivating to have a tracker watch that is giving me feedback on steps, miles, heart rate, calories burned (never enough...), etc. I use a Garmin watch and can see recent runs and time/mile on my phone, or I can download it all to Excel and be totally OCD with tracking, graphs, pivot tables, etc. There are other watches that have similar features and functions.
6. Don't skimp on footwear. The difference between ok and really good running shoes isn't that much, and your feet will thank you for spending a little extra.

Apologies if I'm saying things you already know, but glad to see you online.

 

[SheHulk]

Thanking about going all-liquid for my in-race nutrition at Chicago. I bought a few packs of Tailwind, a few packs of the Maurten 320 mix, and a hand-held bottle. Trying them out on the next few long runs. Any tips are appreciated.

 

[Mr_Incr3dible]

ATTQOTD: Big fan of Petzl headlamps. Cheap, lightweight, produce plenty of light to see where I’m going in areas with no street lights. Bonus points for being clutch in the days after hurricanes when we have no power!

I have some head lamps that I have used for camping and working on cars, but I'm not sure for a long race.
With an upcoming night race, I went on Amazon and purchased a ball cap with LEDs built into the bill. It may not be a ton of light, but hopefully enough with the other runners around me. I'll report back after I get the hat.

And nothing like someone else to put your own troubles into perspective. The guy next to me at PT was/is a trail runner who tore a tendon to his knee and won't be running until at least January, which makes my issue look very small in comparison.

 

[DopeyBadger]

Thanking about going all-liquid for my in-race nutrition at Chicago. I bought a few packs of Tailwind, a few packs of the Maurten 320 mix, and a hand-held bottle. Trying them out on the next few long runs. Any tips are appreciated.

Tailwind can be concentrated to as much as 1 scoop per oz and it is still drinkable. You still need to consume the normal amount of water for carb asorption along side it though. But a concentrated form allows you to carry a small container (I like this Hammer nutrition hand-held because it can easily slide into my shorts pocket (link)). I then supplement with a different water bottle in training (loops at my house) or using multiple aid station cups when racing.

The same can't be done with Maurten 320. The properties of Maurten 320 require it to be diluted to a very specific measure. But the benefit of Maurten 320 is that it is absorbable at a 4.2:1 ratio instead of 2:1 ratio. So you can carry more carbs in a 17oz Maurten 320 than you can in an appropriately diluted 17oz Tailwind. So Maurten 320 can reduce water burden and cut in half the amount of water you carry/must drink.

 

[SheHulk]

Tailwind can be concentrated to as much as 1 scoop per oz and it is still drinkable. You still need to consume the normal amount of water for carb asorption along side it though. But a concentrated form allows you to carry a small container (I like this Hammer nutrition hand-held because it can easily slide into my shorts pocket (link)). I then supplement with a different water bottle in training (loops at my house) or using multiple aid station cups when racing.

The same can't be done with Maurten 320. The properties of Maurten 320 require it to be diluted to a very specific measure. But the benefit of Maurten 320 is that it is absorbable at a 4.2:1 ratio instead of 2:1 ratio. So you can carry more carbs in a 17oz Maurten 320 than you can in an appropriately diluted 17oz Tailwind. So Maurten 320 can reduce water burden and cut in half the amount of water you carry/must drink.

Very interesting. I'll keep that in mind as I'm trying these things in training. I should try to mimic race conditions so if I plan on carrying Tailwind concentrated and then also taking on-course water in the race, I should do something similar to that when I try it in training, rather than drinking it diluted in training.

Edited to add: Are you saying I shouldn't take on any on-course water during the race if I am using the Maurten?

 

[DopeyBadger]

Edited to add: Are you saying I shouldn't take on any on-course water during the race if I am using the Maurten?

If you drink 17oz Maurten that you've pre-mixed then you'll properly absorb the 79g of carbs it contains. But you should drink more water if you take in carbs beyond the 79g you get from a single serving of Maurten. For instance, if you drink 17oz Maurten and eat 2 GUs (at 25g carb each), then you would minimally want to drink an additional 25oz of water (to absorb the GUs) when racing. If you instead drank two 17oz Maurtens, then you wouldn't have to drink more water while on course.

Drink to thirst beyond the requirements for carb consumption. So if you drink your 17oz Maurten, and find you're still thirsty when running, then by all means drink additional liquid. So not that you can't/shouldn't drink more water beyond Maurten, but that it is the minimum you should be consuming.

Keep in mind, if you were to consume 2 GUs on course and needed 25oz of water to absorb those, you can't substitute that water need with Gatorade. Gatorade (or like liquids with carbs in them) are already isotonic and mixed to the pre-requisite carbz ratio. Such that the liquid Gatorade is not a useable liquid for absorbing the GUs you consume.

My marathon race strategy mixes Maurten 320, concentrated Tailwind, Maurten caff gel, Maurten non-caff gel, and E-gels. I do this because no one source has everything I'm looking for. So by mixing multiple sources I can check off several different nutritional variables I'm trying to check off. My consumption per hour numbers are very high and require me to be able to tolerate a high volume of water (93g carb/hr, 646mg sodium/hr, 145mg potassium/hr, and ~40oz water/hr). But I've found this system is tolerable for my body and helps maximize my performance.

 

[SheHulk]

I've complained for years that Gu makes me want to puke after a few of them, but whenever you remind me how much water you are supposed to take in, to absorb those carbs, I realize I never came close to that in a race. I grab 1-2 of the little half-filled dixie cups and that's it, per Gu. No wonder they messed with my stomach after a few hours of taking one every 45 min.

Anyway, I'll try these liquid options, and see how I feel. Running with a hand-held might drive me nuts, even if it does have a strap so I'm not clutching it.

 

[nancipants]

Anyway, I'll try these liquid options, and see how I feel. Running with a hand-held might drive me nuts, even if it does have a strap so I'm not clutching it.

I run with a handheld all the time (Florida humidity), and I barely even notice it anymore.

 

[avondale]

Anyway, I'll try these liquid options, and see how I feel. Running with a hand-held might drive me nuts, even if it does have a strap so I'm not clutching it.

That's why you get a hydration vest. Nothing to hold in your hand and they can take the place of a belt or pocket to hold things. And as you were saying, it's hard to get enough liquids from aid stations unless there are lots of stations or you stop and drink several little cups.

For my trail marathon in April, I had the 1.5-L reservoir on the back with my vest, and carried two 0.5-L soft flasks in the front pockets of the vet. Since we had a drop-bag option, halfway through I swapped out the two empty 0.5-L flasks for filled ones.

 

[SheHulk]

That's why you get a hydration vest. Nothing to hold in your hand and they can take the place of a belt or pocket to hold things. And as you were saying, it's hard to get enough liquids from aid stations unless there are lots of stations or you stop and drink several little cups.

Great idea in general, but Chicago doesn't allow hydration vests. Also it looks very sweaty!

 

[dobball23]

If you drink 17oz Maurten that you've pre-mixed then you'll properly absorb the 79g of carbs it contains. But you should drink more water if you take in carbs beyond the 79g you get from a single serving of Maurten. For instance, if you drink 17oz Maurten and eat 2 GUs (at 25g carb each), then you would minimally want to drink an additional 25oz of water (to absorb the GUs) when racing. If you instead drank two 17oz Maurtens, then you wouldn't have to drink more water while on course.

Drink to thirst beyond the requirements for carb consumption. So if you drink your 17oz Maurten, and find you're still thirsty when running, then by all means drink additional liquid. So not that you can't/shouldn't drink more water beyond Maurten, but that it is the minimum you should be consuming.

Keep in mind, if you were to consume 2 GUs on course and needed 25oz of water to absorb those, you can't substitute that water need with Gatorade. Gatorade (or like liquids with carbs in them) are already isotonic and mixed to the pre-requisite carbz ratio. Such that the liquid Gatorade is not a useable liquid for absorbing the GUs you consume.

My marathon race strategy mixes Maurten 320, concentrated Tailwind, Maurten caff gel, Maurten non-caff gel, and E-gels. I do this because no one source has everything I'm looking for. So by mixing multiple sources I can check off several different nutritional variables I'm trying to check off. My consumption per hour numbers are very high and require me to be able to tolerate a high volume of water (93g carb/hr, 646mg sodium/hr, 145mg potassium/hr, and ~40oz water/hr). But I've found this system is tolerable for my body and helps maximize my performance.

I have copied @DopeyBadger's fueling strategy and it seems to work well for me, too. I don't have a lot to compare it to, though, since before I started trying this, my strategy was to just take whatever was offered at aid stations.

I have two of the Hammer bottles linked above as well. I use them during training and races for Tailwind.

 

[Grabnar]

Does Disney allow hydration vests?

 

[kps7795]

Does Disney allow hydration vests?

Disney allows pretty much anything that you want to wear during their races. Definitely hydration vests. I remember during my first runDisney race which was the 2022 marathon, I saw a lot of runners wearing Nathan hydration vests and I was wondering "who the hell is Nathan?" LOL

 

[katiekinzakat]

1. Kudos for getting back into running
2. Feel free to participate and not lurk
3. If you want to do 2025 marathon, be ready to sign up in March(?) of 2024. I missed seeing my reminder earlier this year, so no entry for 2024 (at this time)
4. Start training now and do some shorter races to figure out what does/doesn't work for you
5. I find it very useful and motivating to have a tracker watch that is giving me feedback on steps, miles, heart rate, calories burned (never enough...), etc. I use a Garmin watch and can see recent runs and time/mile on my phone, or I can download it all to Excel and be totally OCD with tracking, graphs, pivot tables, etc. There are other watches that have similar features and functions.
6. Don't skimp on footwear. The difference between ok and really good running shoes isn't that much, and your feet will thank you for spending a little extra.

Apologies if I'm saying things you already know, but glad to see you online.

Ah thanks for the warm welcome!

I’ve actually done 4 runDisney half marathons in the past (5 if you count the one that wasn’t in 2017!) but a combination of grad school, covid, and moving from Orlando to the UK has caused quite the hiatus from both Disney and running as my last race was in 2018. So it does feel like I’m starting from scratch!

2025 is still very much a pipe dream if I’m being honest. I haven’t yet told my fiancé that I’m interested and our holiday budget is still very much up in the air. It’s not as easy a decision as when I lived in FL and could drive in on the day if I really had to. I’ll still set a reminder now though, a gal can dream!

Hopefully, I’ll actually be motivated to run for more than a month this time around. I do hope to pop by here more frequently and I’m sure that once I actually sign up for my next race I’ll have much more to contribute.

 

[kps7795]

Ah thanks for the warm welcome!

I’ve actually done 4 runDisney half marathons in the past (5 if you count the one that wasn’t in 2017!) but a combination of grad school, covid, and moving from Orlando to the UK has caused quite the hiatus from both Disney and running as my last race was in 2018. So it does feel like I’m starting from scratch!

2025 is still very much a pipe dream if I’m being honest. I haven’t yet told my fiancé that I’m interested and our holiday budget is still very much up in the air. It’s not as easy a decision as when I lived in FL and could drive in on the day if I really had to. I’ll still set a reminder now though, a gal can dream!

Hopefully, I’ll actually be motivated to run for more than a month this time around. I do hope to pop by here more frequently and I’m sure that once I actually sign up for my next race I’ll have much more to contribute.

The great thing for you is that you have parkruns to enjoy in the meantime. Someday, I want to go back to the UK to enjoy the atmosphere of a parkrun.

 

[Bree]

Thanking about going all-liquid for my in-race nutrition at Chicago. I bought a few packs of Tailwind, a few packs of the Maurten 320 mix, and a hand-held bottle. Trying them out on the next few long runs. Any tips are appreciated.

Tailwind makes handy dandy individual packets. I use those on the race course. I am pretty fast ripping it open while running, dumping in my bottle and filling the bottle at the water stop. I’m also learning that Tailwind is just not enough to keep my hungry tummy happy so I eat Huma gels and drink extra water to absorb them or carry uncrustables. I don’t like anything in my hands while running so I use a belt. The one I use is the UltrAspire. I have the one bottle and two bottle versions and they sit at the small of my back. Nathan makes a similar one, but I found the bottle to be heavier and too stiff pulling in and out of the holder. Chicago says no vests, but there were definitely people using them. I would be too afraid to risk it though.

 

[Herding_Cats]

Thanking about going all-liquid for my in-race nutrition at Chicago. I bought a few packs of Tailwind, a few packs of the Maurten 320 mix, and a hand-held bottle. Trying them out on the next few long runs. Any tips are appreciated.

Make sure you PRACTICE with concentrated tailwind. I used it for my first marathon and I’m pretty sure I concentrated it too much and had some gut issues that I never had during training (and I practiced with it during training and then screwed it up on race morning)

 

[SheHulk]

Tailwind makes handy dandy individual packets. I use those on the race course. I am pretty fast ripping it open while running, dumping in my bottle and filling the bottle at the water stop. I’m also learning that Tailwind is just not enough to keep my hungry tummy happy so I eat Huma gels and drink extra water to absorb them or carry uncrustables. I don’t like anything in my hands while running so I use a belt. The one I use is the UltrAspire. I have the one bottle and two bottle versions and they sit at the small of my back. Nathan makes a similar one, but I found the bottle to be heavier and too stiff pulling in and out of the holder. Chicago says no vests, but there were definitely people using them. I would be too afraid to risk it though.

Yeah the guy at the running store suggested both Huma gels and uncrustables to try with the Tailwind! Great minds think alike. I took a Huma gel from him to try. He also suggested pierogies (??!! but he is an ultra runner so I guess people do that). The only other city besides Philadelphia that I think pierogies might be something you carry around, would be Chicago so maybe it's worth trying.

Make sure you PRACTICE with concentrated tailwind. I used it for my first marathon and I’m pretty sure I concentrated it too much and had some gut issues that I never had during training (and I practiced with it during training and then screwed it up on race morning)

Yeah I will for sure. I could see this happening to me.

 

[Herding_Cats]

Yeah the guy at the running store suggested both Huma gels and uncrustables to try with the Tailwind! Great minds think alike. I took a Huma gel from him to try.

I looooooove raspberry huma gels. The chia makes it taste exactly like raspberry jam, right down to the texture. It does get a little bit runny when it’s been in my pocket for awhile.

 

[Bree]

Yeah the guy at the running store suggested both Huma gels and uncrustables to try with the Tailwind! Great minds think alike. I took a Huma gel from him to try. He also suggested pierogies (??!! but he is an ultra runner so I guess people do that). The only other city besides Philadelphia that I think pierogies might be something you carry around, would be Chicago so maybe it's worth trying.

Yeah I will for sure. I could see this happening to me.

Pierogies? I love them, but not sure about when running. I sure hope he isn’t eating the cabbage ones Maybe I’ll pick up some apple or potato ones and try it.

My favorite Huma right now are the chocolate and the mocha. They are caffeinated, but it doesn’t bother me. For regular I like the blueberry, raspberry or apple. I sometimes bring Endurance Tap too. Man, I sound like I pack the entire kitchen when I’m running