About time! Washington Redskins announce intention to change nickname

[BrianL]

It's only the logo they are upset about, not the name.

That's an interesting article though and it highlights what I mean when I say these things are more complicated than people make them out to be. Could they keep the logo with a different name? Would that be acceptible? Does it make a difference that a Native American designed it? I'm not purporting to have any answers, I'm just asking the questions, which is a step that is often skipped these days.

 

[Kestryl]

They should keep the name but change the mascot.

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I’m going to be incredibly disappointed when they announce the new name and it’s not “Washington Potatoes.”

 

[mousefan73]

I thought all the Indians nicknames were becuse they are a proud people and a awesome fighter , I would look at it as a compliment. I guess the Indians, Braves and Black Hawks are next, lets delete them also

Just read the Blackhawks will not change their name, as a Chicagoan, thank God... There is a history though as the name Black Hawk is an actual person. So there is history to it.

 

[littlejimmy]

Just read the Blackhawks will not change their name, as a Chicagoan, thank God... There is a history though as the name Black Hawk is an actual person. So there is history to it.

then we need to study Black Hawks history and if he ever did anything wrong, we need to cancel him. who is with me? This was sarcasm.

 

[rodbates0322]

Serious question. who decides its offensive? Because everything I read, Native Americans overwhelmingly support the current name. and if it changes to the Warriors, I am seriously upset at Marquette for changing its nickname years ago.

I don't mind that they are changing the name but you are right about the support. If I remember correctly a survey was done and only 1 out of 10 Native Americans were offended by the name. Also from what I understand Native Americans in Bayard, New Mexico have schools with the mascot as Redskins and embrace it.

However I think Washington Warriors would be a good new name.

Washington Post Poll from 2016:

"Was there really a poll in which 9 out of 10 Native Americans said they were not offended by the 'Redskins' moniker?"

Answer: Yes. The poll was released by The Washington Post in 2016.

Quote from the article about Bayard, NM:

"Morales said he talked to Native Americans in his community who felt the middle school and high school should keep the team names. "

 

[mousefan73]

This thread is causing me anxiety and I never have anxiety. Never thought I would have such an emotion on this. But I get how this cancel culture can have its point in some cases, but we are dangerously reaching the point where we are “canceling” too much people who never had a side on this are going to get angry. Especially with Covid going on. For me personally I have had so much literally canceled and so many major changes in my life the past four months that I just had a mini anxiety attack thinking what if the University of Illinois would have to change their name away from the fighting Illini? PThat just got personal as I was once a fighting Illini.

 

[littlejimmy]

This thread is causing me anxiety and I never have anxiety. Never thought I would have such an emotion on this. But I get how this cancel culture can have its point in some cases, but we are dangerously reaching the point where we are “canceling” too much people who never had a side on this are going to get angry. Especially with Covid going on. For me personally I have had so much literally canceled and so many major changes in my life the past four months that I just had a mini anxiety attack thinking what if the University of Illinois would have to change their name away from the fighting Illini? PThat just got personal as I was once a fighting Illini.

I was a Marquette Warrior. I get it.

 

[easyas123]

About time! Washington Redskins announce intention to change nickname

Forgive my ignorance, I'm not a big follower of football - but if as the title says the Redskins is the nickname, what is the actual name, and why don't they just use whatever the actual name it?
I've heard it referenced on two other news shows I've seen in the past 24 hours, the use of the phrase 'nickname". It has me puzzled - if it's a nickname, what is the real name?!?!

 

[Orion Nebula]

I don’t get why only the Redskins get so much flack and not the Indians, Braves, and Chiefs.

Because "Redskins" is a derogatory term.

 

[starvenger]

I just thought it was ironic that people who were the victims of racism also practiced racism.

I think it was more akin to POWs and indentured servitude than racism.

About time! Washington Redskins announce intention to change nickname

Forgive my ignorance, I'm not a big follower of football - but if as the title says the Redskins is the nickname, what is the actual name, and why don't they just use whatever the actual name it?
I've heard it referenced on two other news shows I've seen in the past 24 hours, the use of the phrase 'nickname". It has me puzzled - if it's a nickname, what is the real name?!?!

As I understand it, nickname is the term used for the common moniker used by the team. In most cases "Team name" and "Team nickname" are one and the same. But it is not necessarily the official name.

For example, Toronto's CFL team is officially the Toronto Argonaut Football Club, but the nickname would be "Argonauts" or "Argos".

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I don’t get why only the Redskins get so much flack and not the Indians, Braves, and Chiefs.

The Kansas City Chiefs are not named in a reference directly to Native Americans though yes there are things here and there that are of Native American theme related to the team. The logo (which is also the name of the stadium) is an arrowhead but I'm not entirely certain that could be construed as offensive and has been changed for decades to not have a Native American to it.

 

[JimMIA]

I think it was more akin to POWs and indentured servitude than racism.

No it wasn't. No nice words for it -- it was slavery.

Many of the Indian slaves in the Southeastern US were Africans bought from the Spanish or English/American slave traders. Contrary to the New York Times and conventional wisdom, the Spanish brought the first African slaves to North America in 1565, when they settled St. Augustine, FL.

Various Florida Indian tribes got African slaves almost immediately, and by the mid-1800's the Seminoles owned thousands of African slaves.

 

[bcla]

The Kansas City Chiefs are not named in a reference directly to Native Americans though yes there are things here and there that are of Native American theme related to the team. The logo and name of the stadium is an arrowhead but I'm not entirely certain that could be construed as offensive and has been changed for decades to not have a Native American to it.

Certain imagery might be appropriate in context. The National Park Service arrowhead logo is clearly native imagery.

The arrowhead shape is supposed to represent historical and archeological values.

 

[JimMIA]

Certain imagery might be appropriate in context. The National Park Service arrowhead logo is clearly native imagery.

The arrowhead shape is supposed to represent historical and archeological values.

Yep, and it's a MUCH better logo after they gave the bison some grass to graze on! I think I still have some of the old "Starving Bison" patches.

 

[starvenger]

No it wasn't. No nice words for it -- it was slavery.

Many of the Indian slaves in the Southeastern US were Africans bought from the Spanish or English/American slave traders. Contrary to the New York Times and conventional wisdom, the Spanish brought the first African slaves to North America in 1565, when they settled St. Augustine, FL.

Various Florida Indian tribes got African slaves almost immediately, and by the mid-1800's the Seminoles owned thousands of African slaves.

We're on different timelines, I think. I was referencing pre-colonization. You were referencing post-colonization.

 

[JimMIA]

Certain imagery might be appropriate in context. The National Park Service arrowhead logo is clearly native imagery.

The arrowhead shape is supposed to represent historical and archeological values.

NPS also used the arrowhead for the commemorative Centennial Year badge in 2016. I took a pic of mine, but it will only load sideways for some crazy reason...this is a stock photo.

 

[sam_gordon]

About time! Washington Redskins announce intention to change nickname

Forgive my ignorance, I'm not a big follower of football - but if as the title says the Redskins is the nickname, what is the actual name, and why don't they just use whatever the actual name it?
I've heard it referenced on two other news shows I've seen in the past 24 hours, the use of the phrase 'nickname". It has me puzzled - if it's a nickname, what is the real name?!?!

It's not really a "nickname", it's a "mascot" (I can't think of a better term).
Washington Redskins
Cleveland Indians
New England Patriots
San Francisco 49ers
Kansas City Royals
New York Knicks
Indianaopolis Pacers

For some reason US teams have "mascots". This is from professional level (in all sports) all the way down to middle school at least. Some organized youth teams have mascots.

What I've found interesting is (near as I can tell) professional and club soccer in other countries don't bother with mascots. FC Barcelona, Real Madrid, Manchester City, etc. Although Tottenham is the "Hotspurs".

 

[bcla]

NPS also used the arrowhead for the commemorative Centennial Year badge in 2016. I took a pic of mine, but it will only load sideways for some crazy reason...this is a stock photo.

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I know of only one Disney movie that used the NPS logo - Planes: Fire & Rescue. I'm pretty sure they got the permission of the National Park Service to use their logo, or at least a variation on it with a wild tractor instead of a bison. The main sign looks like a combination of the lettering style from Yellowstone and the shape of a Forest Service sign.

This was the shape I was thinking of:

Sorry about going off topic. But I guess we were discussing the appropriate use of arrowhead symbols.

 

[Boopuff]

Name them all after inanimate objects. Can't offend anyone with that - unless you pick a certain cultures artifact as your object... Stanford University several years ago changed from the Indians the "tree". My Dad was a Stanford grad and thought the change was hilarious. (fighting trees! LOL)

 

[starvenger]

Name them all after inanimate objects. Can't offend anyone with that - unless you pick a certain cultures artifact as your object... Stanford University several years ago changed from the Indians the "tree". My Dad was a Stanford grad and thought the change was hilarious. (fighting trees! LOL)

Fun fact: Part of my Cantonese name translates to "forest". I tell my wife that this is the reason why I'm fat.