Agree to Disagree! DISUnplugged Show March 22!

[EricInPA]

Recently we've seen preferred parking, but how close are we to having to pay to meet Mickey?

Like character dining?

When will Disney World feel like a carnival where I have pay for every experience?

That's how it all started. With a ticket book.

 

[mnra]

My concern is this. Even though they have had the vip tours etc for a long time. I still could see the fireworks and just had to sit on curb or stay in one spot. What I worry about is what happens if every day the close the parks at 7 so they can start to have hard ticket events. I believe the hard tickets events are greater in number now then they used to be. The other thing I would be interested in is does Disneyland have the same amount of hard ticket events as Disney World.

 

[kbelle8995]

My response is that I will not pay for it. Look an extra three hours in the park even with the inclusion of novelty ice cream and free drinks for $150.00 isn't worth it to me. And as for the premium parking price, I am okay with walking or taking the tram.

Others will have a different opinion and will pay the price. And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the prices on these options rose in the future.

 

[SarahDisney]

Assuming I'm understanding him correctly, I think I'm with Steve on this one.
I understand that Disney can charge for premium events, and I understand that people will pay for it. But it really seems like Disney is heading in a direction where they're taking experiences that were previously included with your tickets and charging for them.

I travel on a budget, and I can still experience everything I want to experience. My last trip was 7 nights at Pop, 5 park days (we would have done more, but it's just how our schedule worked out), 2 runDisney races, 2 princess meals, seeing Wishes (twice), Illuminations, Fantasmic!, and the Star Wars fireworks, mini golf, a crapload of character meets (I didn't count them all, but it was a lot), 13 fastpasses in one day (and 3-4 on each of our other park days), some food, some souvenirs ... and oh yeah, flights from NY to Orlando ... all for under $4000 (I think it was closer to $3000) for two people.
Unfortunately, I don't know when I'll be going back to Disney, but when I do, I'm nervous that for my $4000 (or the equivalent in future dollars), all I'm going to get is a few nights at a hotel, tickets, 3 FP+ per day, and maybe an obstructed view of some fireworks. I don't want to pay extra for more fastpasses or for decent viewing for shows/fireworks, and I don't want them to charge even more for my character meals. But I'm afraid that they're going in the direction of "if we can charge for something that's free now or double the price of something, let's do it," and that worries me.

I have no problem with premium events and opportunities ... as long as they're not taking anything away from those who can't afford (or don't want) to pay those prices. When you start taking away my ability to experience something because you want to only offer that opportunity to people who are willing to pay big bucks for it. If this $150 after hours event is in addition to EMH (and EMH are still included for onsite guests), I have no problem with it. But if they start taking away EMH and instead offering the paid after dark as the only way to stay past the regular park hours ... I will be more than a little disappointed.
Same thing with FP+ ... if you want to offer someone the opportunity to purchase extra FP+ in advance (or offer extra FP+ in advance to certain hotels), I don't love that idea, but I'm okay with it ... as long as I can still pull up my app and get more FP+ in the park once I've finished my first three. If it's "3 FP+ a day included and pay extra for any additional" ... that I'm not okay with.

And yes, I know that back in the day there were ticket books. But once they went away from the ticket books ... going back isn't so easy. The system was obviously changed for a reason, and now that it has been changed, I'm not happy with the idea of changing it back.

Of course, this is just my opinion. Feel free to disagree - I'm not that offended if you don't see things my way.

 

[sporter5353]

@TheMaxRebo "But what if the alternative is charging $500 a day and then everything is included - is that better or having $100/day for basic access and then ability to upgrade experiences if you want?" First off that is a huge over estimation? These recent changes that used to be first come, first served aren't costing people $400 (thank god). Preferred parking is $15 dollars extra...it is all just nickel and diming.

~53,000 guests come to the Magic Kingdom every day. Lets say they charge $50 for any guests sitting in special viewing and they have 200 seats for this special area. That means Disney brings in $10,000 extra that they didn't before. How about they just charge everyone $1 more to their park ticket and that area is first come first served? Everyone wins Disney makes $53,000 instead of $10,000, and no one has to hear me complain about it.

@EricInPA You missed the point...character dining isn't anything new...the entire argument is that these are experiences that were free/first come, first served and now they come at a premium. If the normal meet and greets become something guests have to pay extra for Disney will have lost its magic IMO.

 

[pontikes67]

Is it weird that I agreed with EVERYONE during today's show?

I know that's strange, but Steve would say something and I'd be like "YEAH!" Then Kevin would say something and I'd be like "YEAH!" Ditto for Techols, Pete, John, and Kathy. I even agreed with what Craig said, for crying out loud.

I guess that's the sign of a good debate. Even when you disagree with the other viewpoint, you can at least appreciate the sentiment/thinking behind it.

Good show.

I think no one has the 'exclusive rights' to this argument. As I noted in a post, it's multi-faceted and everyone has a fair argument to defend. I think where I come in is in the past it was my choice to lie in bed or get up and get to the parks and avoid waiting or experience whatever 'perk' I felt was important. That was there for ANYONE with a ticket; that doesn't seem to be the route they're going.

Disney to me felt different. Six Flags has preferred parking, Flash Pass (3 tiers that you can pay for up to $125 per person in your party in addition to your park ticket). I don't want Walt Disney World to take the lead from Six Flags...please!

 

[TheMaxRebo]

@TheMaxRebo "But what if the alternative is charging $500 a day and then everything is included - is that better or having $100/day for basic access and then ability to upgrade experiences if you want?" First off that is a huge over estimation? These recent changes that used to be first come, first served aren't costing people $400 (thank god). Preferred parking is $15 dollars extra...it is all just nickel and diming.

~53,000 guests come to the Magic Kingdom every day. Lets say they charge $50 for any guests sitting in special viewing and they have 200 seats for this special area. That means Disney brings in $10,000 extra that they didn't before. How about they just charge everyone $1 more to their park ticket and that area is first come first served? Everyone wins Disney makes $53,000 instead of $10,000, and no one has to hear me complain about it.

I was thinking of everything - that is and maybe is to come. So yeah, maybe $20 for preferred viewing but then plus the $149 for the extra hours, plus $20 for parking, plus whatever for charging for extra fast passes or whatever else is to come (plus may have been exaggerating a bit for emphasis)

I agree that is sucks to think about Disney World nickel and diming people because you, me, all of us want to have really positive feelings for Disney - and I also fully agree this is heading down a bad path if taken to extremes (i.e., you want to see the parade at all? $25 ... want to meet Mickey at all? $30 .... want to see the fireworks at all? $50) ... but as long as it is for "extras" or "preferred viewing" I think people can choose to pay it or not and still get to experience being at Disney World

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Disney to me felt different. Six Flags has preferred parking, Flash Pass (3 tiers that you can pay for up to $125 per person in your party in addition to your park ticket). I don't want Walt Disney World to take the lead from Six Flags...please!

I think that gets to the heart of the argument .. and similar to the argument against Tiered pricing. Disney is "different" and I don't want Disney to be just like everything else and this feels like them moving towards that. And I think there is something to that if you change what makes you different then you don't become the destination or special thing that people save up for and then you aren't attracting the crowds you used to ... and while all signs point to record crowds and sold out resorts - this is something that can erode perception over time. It won't hurt their bottom line this year or next, but will our kids feel the same about Disney as we do if they continue down this path?

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Also, I want to stand up and applaud @WebmasterPete for his comments during the show .... when filming things you have to hold your phone horizontally! Forget charging people premiums - just start fining people that don't know the proper way to take video!

 

[mnra]

will our kids feel the same about Disney as we do if they continue down this path?


NO because they won't be able to afford to go. If they charge for everything extra.

 

[JJZMgailey]

I think I'm going to have to stick to the comments I made during the show today and reiterate that I really feel these decisions being made are more about crowd control than they are about Disney wanting more money. The Parks are packed and Guests complain. MNSSHP, MVMCP, and other Special Events are packed and Guests complain. They have to do something or it's going to continue to be an all-out uproar online and everywhere. Like most people, I don't like all of these charges for extras, but they are a smart business and they've got a great product that people want.

Also, Disney Parks donated 2 million dollars to Make-A-Wish Foundation for their #ShareYourEars campaign - double their original pledge! They don't have to do stuff like that if they're not so inclined to. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't do it if they couldn't spare the 2 million. At least they're proactively having Guests fill out surveys so they can try to improve these things.

In fact, I think I remember seeing a survey last year that asked if I'd like to see more hard-ticket events; I say 'yes' and I'm sure lots of others did too!

In the times I've been to Disneyland, the only times I've ever seen the crowds even remotely compare to WDW was the week between Christmas and New Year's so I wouldn't expect to see these kinds of nickel and diming things happening there.

Magic costs money to make - Cast Members, electricity, water, gardeners, the list goes on for miles . . .

 

[EricInPA]

You missed the point...character dining isn't anything new...the entire argument is that these are experiences that were free/first come, first served and now they come at a premium. If the normal meet and greets become something guests have to pay extra for Disney will have lost its magic IMO.

Character dining isn't new... right now, but it was once new. And it's a decent comparison. I can wait in line to see the Winnie the Pooh characters, or I can pay extra for a character buffet at the Crystal Palace and see them without waiting and while eating. Limited on cash? Stay off site and drive in for the day. Have plenty of cash? Get a room at the Polynesian, ride the monorail and never drive.

I do find it somewhat ironic that Disney introduces something like Club Villain (an expensive and exclusive character event), it gets smashing reviews.... and then we sit here and wonder why they keep creating more of those things. Disney asks if people like these things and people overwhelmingly say "Yes!"

As the title of the thread says: "Agree to Disagree"

 

[Love2Run]

It sounds like you want Disney to be funded similar to government or more specifically the affordable care act. Spread the cost across the masses to benefit the greater good. Government should benefit the greater good but Disney is a private company and their objective is to make money. They make money by creating experiences and products their customers want/demand.

I don't want my ticket price to go up so that twice as many people can camp out for hours to get a "great" view of the parade. (Even if it is just a $1 increase. I would rather use that to get 1/4 of a diet coke) I don't care about the parade at this point in my life and in a couple years when maybe I do, I would rather have the option to pay $25 to get a good seat.

And to say Disney never use to nickel and dime people is inaccurate. They have charged by attraction AND they charged for extra magic hours as Kevin said today.

 

[JJZMgailey]

I do find it somewhat ironic that Disney introduces something like Club Villain (an expensive and exclusive character event), it gets smashing reviews.... and then we sit here and wonder why they keep creating more of those things. Disney asks if people like these things and people overwhelmingly say "Yes!"

As the title of the thread says: "Agree to Disagree"

YES!!

THIS!!

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Character dining isn't new... right now, but it was once new. And it's a decent comparison. I can wait in line to see the Winnie the Pooh characters, or I can pay extra for a character buffet at the Crystal Palace and see them without waiting and while eating. Limited on cash? Stay off site and drive in for the day. Have plenty of cash? Get a room at the Polynesian, ride the monorail and never drive.

I do find it somewhat ironic that Disney introduces something like Club Villain (an expensive and exclusive character event), it gets smashing reviews.... and then we sit here and wonder why they keep creating more of those things. Disney asks if people like these things and people overwhelmingly say "Yes!"

As the title of the thread says: "Agree to Disagree"

I don't agree to that

and not to put words in the mouths of some of the members of the podcast that were against this or as @sporter5353 has said here, I don't think the issue is with special hard ticketed events where you are getting something above and beyond (which is what you got with Club Villian) - but rather feeling like Disney is charging you for what you used to get for free ... or creating different classes of guests where there used to not be (parade viewing, etc.) and where that might lead

 

[DLgal]

I think it is pretty obvious, at this point, that Disney is purposely trying to shift the demographic of its visitors. They want people with more disposable income. These are the people who will pay for these types of "extras."

I actually see this happening elsewhere in the travel and leisure industry as well. Cruises have gotten way more expensive and the nickel and diming is almost an epidemic at this point on most mass market lines. Hotels left and right are starting to charge exorbitant resort and parking fees. We just stayed at Great Wolf Lodge and the effective "tax" rate was a whopping 25% per night! Restaurants in our area are starting to host more and more "special dining events" with super high Prix Fixe menus. Theme parks all over are charging for preferred parking, "instant ride access" and special events. There really doesn't seem to be an end in sight.

Disney is perhaps being short sighted in its approach to rolling all this stuff out in succession the way they are. However, they are simply pushing the boundaries to see how far they can go. You think these $150 "EMH" won't sell out? Guaranteed they will. And why wouldn't Disney's response be "let's do more of these!"

And why is everyone not getting that this is FINAALLY a way for off property guests to PAY for a perk that on property guests still get for free. What is so wrong with that? Assuming that EMH will go away in favor of this is ludicrous at this point. EMH is perhaps the most tangible perk for being an on-site guest. No way they do away with it.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I think I'm going to have to stick to the comments I made during the show today and reiterate that I really feel these decisions being made are more about crowd control than they are about Disney wanting more money. The Parks are packed and Guests complain. MNSSHP, MVMCP, and other Special Events are packed and Guests complain. They have to do something or it's going to continue to be an all-out uproar online and everywhere. Like most people, I don't like all of these charges for extras, but they are a smart business and they've got a great product that people want.

Also, Disney Parks donated 2 million dollars to Make-A-Wish Foundation for their #ShareYourEars campaign - double their original pledge! They don't have to do stuff like that if they're not so inclined to. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't do it if they couldn't spare the 2 million. At least they're proactively having Guests fill out surveys so they can try to improve these things.

In fact, I think I remember seeing a survey last year that asked if I'd like to see more hard-ticket events; I say 'yes' and I'm sure lots of others did too!

In the times I've been to Disneyland, the only times I've ever seen the crowds even remotely compare to WDW was the week between Christmas and New Year's so I wouldn't expect to see these kinds of nickel and diming things happening there.

Magic costs money to make - Cast Members, electricity, water, gardeners, the list goes on for miles . . .

To me that is the bigger issue - with removing characters, dirty bathrooms, asking chefs to use cheaper ingredients ... they are making their product less great at the same time charging more for it. Fully agree that Magic costs money and I have no problem spending money on Disney as it has given me an experience and time with my family, etc. I haven't gotten elsewhere - but I worry that things will become (or have become) less magical in the cause of increasing profits and/or offsetting overruns at Shanghai

BTW - I actually saw some posts of people putting down the Make-a-wish donation saying that it was a tax benefit, etc. and didn't really cost them much, etc.

 

[mnra]

they made 8.3 billion last year so a 2 million dollar donation is hardly something I would brag about

 

[rmm7e]

Like character dining?

That's how it all started. With a ticket book.

I thought it all started with a mouse.

I haven't listened yet...not sure I need that stress!

 

[JJZMgailey]

BTW - I actually saw some posts of people putting down the Make-a-wish donation saying that it was a tax benefit, etc. and didn't really cost them much, etc.

they made 8.3 billion last year so a 2 million dollar donation is hardly something I would brag about

My point is that they donated A LOT of money - no bragging needed. Tax write-off or not, if they were money-hungry hounds, they wouldn't give it away at all.