To Infinity and Beyond - Becoming a Better DopeyBadger (Comments Welcome)

Milwaukee Marathon Weekend - 10k: A Coach's Perspective

If you'd like to read the runner's perspective about the race, head here (link). @roxymama did an amazing job of recapping the experience from her side. This recap is from the other side of the experience, as a coach.

This experience for me started on November 15, 2015. I had only been a DIS posting member for about a month, but in November I received a PM from another DIS member.

Title: Help getting to 8k/10k
From: @roxymama


Hi @DopeyBadger ! Would you be interested in suggesting a possible training plan for me for after my WDW 5k weekend? I can answer any questions that will help you "figure me out." Basically I have been running only 5k races this year and I have done at least one per month with a few multiple race months. It was my way of making myself a runner by setting a lot of easy to attain goals. I am running the WDW 5k in Jan but it will not be a "race" for me so I am not training for any kind of PR on that one. But I signed up for an 8k first week of April, then would like to do a 10k in May and in July I have a 5k/10k challenge. End goal is 15k & 10 miler in the fall. I'm hoping you can help me figure out how to get myself to the 10k distance as I'm a little bit lost on best way to take myself to that next distance step.
Currently I run 3 days a week. I was 100% outdoor runner until Daylight savings hit and then Tues/Thur went to treadmill at the gym with a weekend run. Now with snow on the ground I'm probably going to be a treadmill only runner until we get some thaw. I can answer any questions you have. And take your time, I really appreciate the help!


Someone was looking for my help in moving forward in their running career. She was the second person to reach out to me and ask for help. Thus, started a relationship of coach and protege that would extend the next two years leading up to the Milwaukee 10k. Transitioning from a 5k to an 8k to a 10k to a 5k/10k challenge to a 15k to a 10 miler to a HM for fun to a HM for time to a 10k for goal crushing.

The idea for a DIS local meet race came to me after Marathon Weekend 2017. I had a lot of fun putting faces to users and realized it might also be fun to do this outside a Disney race. I knew there were several users in the Chicago/Milwaukee area so I floated the idea out there on a local DIS meet race (link). The Milwaukee Marathon Weekend seemed to match up well with everyone's schedule best and it had several racing options (1 mile, 5k, 10k, HM and M). Since this race was 2 weeks after my "A" goal marathon, I knew I wasn't going to be in racing shape. After most marathons, I take two weeks off to recover and enjoy family life outside running. So, I had an idea. Since @roxymama's pace was towards the slower end of my normal pace I could probably maintain her pace for either a 10K (more likely) or a HM. We settled on the 10k and both spent the next several months training for that day.

So fast-forward to October 2017 and my marathon was over. I wrapped up my one week recovery and needed to figure out whether I was going to be able to maintain her pace for a 10k race. One of my first runs back, 4 miles @ 8:44, I received a comment on my run of "Nice pace!" from @roxymama. Now the whole time it was my intention to keep her blind to race pace. Remove the pace gremlins from the equation. So, now it became apparent she was eyeing up my training runs to gain a slight inclination as to the goal. My response, "Just trying to find my groove in case I need it...". I spent the next several runs varying the pace just to convince myself I would not be a hinderance on race day. Unfortunately, after Thursday's run my groin issue flared up again. It's been on and off since June, but it decided to be on again right before the race. I just iced it and hoped for the best. Moving forward, I've got some ideas to take care of this since it appears to be an issue that isn't going away completely.

Since there had been such a wide love for the fritters after the last couple races, I thought it would be a neat idea to bring some to the finish line for each of the other DIS runners. So Steph was able to pick some up late Saturday night after work and they were GINORMOUS! Which is how I like them. About 10 pounds of doughnut! I got one for each person so then there wouldn't have to be any fighting over the left overs. Because you can trust me when I say, once you start eating it, it's hard to stop. So sharing is usually out of the question...

@roxymama was kind enough to agree to pick-up my packet on Saturday. And that turned out to be more of a god-send than ever intended. G got sick on Saturday with throwing up, fever, sniffles, crying all day, lack of appetite... It was a rough Saturday for kiddo. So having that and packet pickup would have likely been a nightmare. Thankfully, roxymama saved the day.

This race served as a new experience for me. To date, I had run 36 official races. Only once before had the race not been about me and a time goal. Back in April 2014, I ran the Crazy Legs Classic 8k with a friend in college pacing her through her first 8k. It was a fun experience and something I knew I wanted to do more of in the future. But, I was being very selfish. I had my own goals. Which meant each race I ran was with a calculated purpose. Training was scheduled. Races were scheduled. So I spent years working on me, me, me. But this Milwaukee 10k would serve as a pivot point for future racing. I know I'm getting close to my maximum potential. Not there yet, and I'll keep squeezing the orange until I get all the juice out. But eventually, time goals will fade as I'll peak and then get older and slower. So it's always been my intention to look for other avenues to continue enjoying the sport of running. And one of those other avenues (as seen by my 102 goals) is to help pace people I know through races for PRs or other experiences like a BQ.

Race morning, I got up at 3:45am. Quickly showered, took care of the dog, and ate breakfast at 4:25am (PB/honey bagel and banana). I drank some water and that was it for consumption. Planned last bathroom break was roughly 6:30am with the belief that after meeting the HM runners they would start off on their race and us 10k'ers would head to the bathrooms. In the car by 4:35 and off we went. We actually got pretty lucky on the drive over as a deer was standing on the edge of the interstate. It would have been a disastrous outcome if it had been another 2 feet further.

Since G was sick (and quite delirious in the car), Steph and I decided she would just drop me off at the start line and then her and G would hang out at the Collectio not too far from the start. I headed to the start line and was VERY thankful that I had brought my winter coat. The wind was a beast. The weather watch all week went from rain and sorta hot, to colder and very very windy. So having the winter coat with wind breaker was a must standing out in the open. I just started heading over and was lucky enough to run into my mom on the way. She had chosen to run the 10k as well and if the weather was good was hoping for a sub-1 as well. Since there was a bit of wind, and she hates the cold for racing, it was looking like that might be a fringe goal. I had tipped her off earlier that while @roxymama and my goal was a sub-1, that I wasn't quite sure where we would end up. So she was welcome to join us, but to be aware that until we start running I couldn't be positive of the pace.

After meeting up with my mom, we ran into @opusone. Nice to finally meet you! Always fun to put a face to a person on the other side of the internet. After a few minutes, @roxymama had found us as well. Don't remember a ton of the small details of conversation, but I do remember one key part. I had seen prior when @roxymama had done blind runs roxykiddo would provide her a sticker to cover the watch face. Now since I'm DopeyBadger I felt it only appropriate to provide a sticker with the face of Bucky on it. So anytime she wanted to glance at her watch, good ole' Bucky would be staring back at her. Blind running it is for her. I wanted her to not focus on the pace but how she felt. I felt reasonably confident I knew what she was capable of. But I wanted to get a feel for it before I settled on a final goal pace. Although all along I wasn't going to tip my hand at what that pace would be. I would need to judge it based on the WU (bet you didn't guess that was a test) and a few other factors during the race. But the original goal was a 9:00 min/mile. Based on her previous race experience in June, I had her estimated 10k fitness as a 9:14 min/mile. So she completed a 15 week HM training plan between June and October. Now while the HM ended up being not representative of her fitness (way too hot of a race) I knew she had likely also improved since that June estimate. So I had her pegged for a 9:00 min/mile pace.

Not too long after @roxymama showed up, so did @*DisneyDreamer. Another person that I had helped somewhat to this point so another person I had a vested interest in seeing how she would perform on race day. She looked nervous but excited. And since she's had about the worst luck possible for races (always inclement weather of some type) we were all happy this race ended up on the colder side of the spectrum (wind not withstanding). Unfortunately, we never did run into @pixarmom but it wasn't terribly surprising since the race start area was very crowded. I was still hopeful to catch her at the end. Although, I tipped my hand a bit and told the other DIS members to keep an eye for me at the finish line because I had something for them. Didn't completely show the cards, but just come find me. It was my intention to hang around until everyone finished.

So bye to the HM'ers and off to the ports-potties went my mom, roxy, and myself. Right on schedule. I bib'ed myself (first time putting a bib on while wearing the singlet) and then we headed to the start corral. As we headed to the start, we met up with @roxyhubby and roxykiddo. It was a pleasure to meet them as well. And convincing roxykiddo that I was indeed a prince fell without success. Roxyhubby was kind enough to take my and my mother's jacket. We informed them of the coffee shop where Steph was hanging out and they headed there not long after the start. Funny side note. As you may have read from proxy's recap her husband and kid sat at a table with a woman and child. That woman and child just so happened to be the same woman and child that Steph hung out with for a few moments in another coffee shop while waiting for me to finish the Lakefront Marathon two weeks prior. And how do I know that, because Steph was sitting one table down from where roxyhubby and child sat. Yet, neither of them knew each other so they never realized they were the tag-team support group.

We were running a tad low on time, but I knew a brief WU was crucial. So I did a few stretches and then roxy and I headed to do a WU. The goal was to determine what roxy's comfortable pace was. Based on that WU I knew that the 9:00 min/mile was going to be a good place to be. I felt reasonably confident that even though I don't normally hold that specific pace, that with my watch and with my ability to internalize time, that we could hit it pretty consistently.

So we lined up at the start, and then I realized it was fairly crowded where we were standing. So I moved us up. And up. And up. Until we were about 10 people deep from the start line. Lots lots more room. I looked around at the other racers and told roxy I thought if today were a race day for me, I'd probably end up in the top 5. Just judging based on the other runners around us. No pacers, no clocks on course, and no GPS for her. Just me to rely on and trust. We came up with our code words if needed. I wanted short one word ideas to determine things on course. With a 10k, I wanted her to focus on her and not on words. Race brain and all. I also wanted her to listen to music if that's what she wanted. So we came up with Green = go faster, Red = go slower, Drink = give me the water bottle, and Lost = you're losing me. Before too long the announcer counted us down and we were off.

The first mile was all about finding that rhythm and constantly checking my watch. Roxy was side by side with me and my mom was just a tad behind us. For the first couple turns the pace said in the 8:40-9:00 range, but I was confident it was more in the 9:00 range. I felt we may have been getting a little interference with the taller buildings. As we came up on the first mile marker, my watch buzzed early at 8:43. But I was confident that it was wrong because we were a tad early. So I switched to overall time, and as we passed the first marker it was 9:00 on the dot. Throughout the first mile, there was not much of a noticeable pattern to roxy's breathing. So either we were going too slow or it was too early to figure out just yet. I decided to hold the 9 and see what mile 2 brought us.

As mile 2 was happening, I could tell roxy was picking up the breathing so I knew we were close to 10k race effort. So we settled in on the 9 pace. A few times I reached back or to the side to hand her her water bottle. Not too long after the first mile marker I saw the leader of the 5k. He seemed to be doing alright, but it confirmed to me that the gap behind him meant this would be a slower 5k finish. Indeed, if I had been able to race the 5k I would have finished in 2nd place. But that wasn't the goal today, today's goal was roxy and the sub-1 project. So we powered through mile 2. Again I felt as if we were getting some GPS interference. We hit GPS mile 2 with a split of 8:53. But I waited and when we crossed the 2 mile marker it was 18 min exactly. Still hitting that goal 9 min pace. There were a few times where roxy and I ran the tangent. And like she said in her recap it was a good teaching lesson. Don't always follow the crowd. When there's a bend in the road and it makes a "C", try instead to run the straight line of the "D". Let the others follow the bend, you follow the straightest path between corner to corner. As long as there aren't any cones dictating the course on the road, then it's within your power to make those moves legally (unless a course martial tells you differently as well). Because at the end of the day, I will always assume the race has been measured appropriately and certified by the tangent standards that I've studied.

Roxy and I did some weaving through the third mile and a few times I directed her behind me when I notices a shift in the wind. Her breathing was still good and rhythmic. A few times she would take a deep breath or the rhythm would fall and then I'd just barely slow the pace. Then once back on track we'd pick it right back up. I'm not even sure she ever noticed these micro adjustments. So yes roxy, I was paying attention to your breathing the whole time as an indicator for effort. Hit mile 3 and was close to GPS and sign matching up at 9:01. Still right on target.

After we hit mile 3, I told roxy we were just on pace. I didn't specify whose pace, but on pace. But then something strange happened. We had been clicking off the mile markers right on target each time. But this time, the mile 4 marker came up really quick. Like too quick. Like at mile 3.65 on my watch quick. So the question instantly became - short course? or misplaced marker? Now I did turn and tell roxy that it was strange to see the mile 4 marker there. She was so in the zone she never heard me, and it was probably for the best. I figured her watch was buzzing her, but never knew that it wasn't working right. So I was interested to see when the mile 5 marker came which it would end up being. Not surprisingly, the wind picked up in the opposite direction. Now for the most part we were protected because the wind was coming west to east. So since we were running mostly north to south we were safe. And because there's a hill with tall building along the coast, the western direction was blocked from wind. So we had some wind, but not the full brunt force of it. But when we did, I would just motion where roxy should go to get the best drafting. We hit mile 4 at 9:02 per my watch. Right on target.

Roxy was low on water after mile 4 so I was hoping to hit an aid station for her. But the last aid station was on the opposite side of the street. I considered jumping the street and getting some water and racing back. But decided against it. We powered up a small hill and saw a large on ramp. I joked with roxy we should go that way instead. Didn't seem to be any takers. As we came on the downhill I saw the 5 mile mark. Took a glance at the watch and saw 4.7 miles. Knew now that the course was short. Tangent running will cut some if measure inappropriately. But not this much, and not this suddenly. And so either two signs placed wrong, or short course. It became clear it was a short course. But what do I say to her? Do I tell her now? Or just keep pretending everything is fine. I decided to keep it to myself until it was much later. We came through mile 5 at 9:02.

Now I could tell from her breathing she was starting to get tired. Things were clearly getting tougher to her. So I just continued to give her encouragement. Looking strong. Great job. We're crushing it. But roxy, we're just a bit slower than goal pace. It was a lie. I knew we were going to get it easy. But I wanted to feed her a little motivation. Not sure whether she heard it, and based on her recap maybe she didn't. But I learned from the Psychobiological Model that if you manipulate amount of time running left or pace feedback you can change a person's motivational response and intensity. We powered through. When there was about 0.2 miles left, I gave her the news.

Roxy, do you care more about 6.2 miles or the finish line? Huh? Do you care more about 6.2 miles or the finish line? Huh? The course is short. We can turn now and make sure we get 6.2 miles or we can take what the course gives us and finish. I want the finish. I want the time based on the course like everyone else. Sounds good. Then we've only got about 2 minutes left so I want you to give me everything you've got.

As we approached the finish line, I kept looking back and saying they're coming they're coming. Someone is trying to beat you. I was just trying to squeeze those last few ounces of effort out of her. We crossed the finish line and we were done. She looks at me and says, what's the time? I raise up my watch and show her.... 52:49. She says, GET OUT! As she pushes me. That moment will stick with me for a while. That pure joy and elation on her face for accomplishing her goal. But she didn't just accomplish it, SHE CRUSHED IT! An official PR of 1:05. An unofficial PR of 1:02. And here we stand, with no pace gremlins, with good but not ideal race conditions and we've got a 52:49. Now, the bad news. The course was short. It was only 5.9 miles. Some of it tangents, but somewhere a missed turn. As roxy stated, the course was short. No more proof needed than my Strava map vs official map:

Official

Screen Shot 2017-10-16 at 8.51.54 AM.png

Mine
Screen Shot 2017-10-16 at 8.52.28 AM.png

Missing stretch by satellite measurement:

Screen Shot 2017-10-16 at 8.55.48 AM.png

So we lost about 0.5 miles because of the turn too early. I measure us at 5.9 miles + 0.5 miles leads to a 6.4 mile race. Now I had assumed that a 10k is not always 6.22 miles by GPS. Just happens because of tangents and GPS inaccuracy, so the goal had always been to run a pace at 6.4 miles that I knew would still be sub-1 (9:22 min/mile or better). Who knows what went wrong? Just based on the satellite image there's no break in the median where the official course shows the turn so I'm not sure what their intention was ever going to be there.

http://www.usatf.org/events/courses...tionYear=&lastName=&format=view&submit=Search

Screen Shot 2017-10-16 at 9.00.45 AM.png

Based on the description on the certification, it was suppose to be further up than that intersection. So yes, it was a short course per your own certification Milwaukee...

Regardless, we got the goal. Well under sub-1 to leave no doubt in my mind that even on a 6.22 mile course or 6.4 mile course we were clear. Estimated 6.22 based on pace was 55:40, well under goal. And also set a new 5k PR of 27:37 during the race. Kudos roxy! We met up with our families and exchanged congrats. @rteetz found us and we were all happy with the outcome. Roxy broke out her surprise of a "Coach's Whistle" and I broke out my surprise of Apple Fritters. Everyone felt satisfied. rteetz and roxy headed out and I stuck around until my mom came through the finish. Then she left, and I waited for @opusone to finish. It was fun to see him cross the line and then surprise him with his own apple fritter. We headed up to the finish line hopeful to catch @pixarmom. Somehow, I never saw her finish even though I was standing there.

Then @opusone left to go get a jacket while I waited for @*DisneyDreamer to cross the line. Did see a bit of weirdness. Quite a few purple bibs (marathons) came across quite early. Most seemed to have just turned at the HM mark. But one in particular stuck out. A guy dressed in a Brewers uniform came just a few minutes behind the winner of the marathon (2:22). He did not look appropriately dressed for a sub 2:30 marathon. Just before the finish line he stopped and took a bib out of his pocket and handed to a spectator. It was a purple marathon bib. He crossed the line without a bib on, but when he crossed they announced the name of David Luy. He shows up as a 2:23 Marathon finish. I looked up David Luy in Athlinks from WI and found a few results. A 2:25 HM from May and a 3:32 Ironman 70.3 from July. I'm not going to delve any further than that. I saw the guy later with @opusone and he had a blue finisher's so he took the HM medal. But he had a purple bib, so he clearly opted to end early. My guess is that his bib was picked up by the "name" timing mat (used to announce people) and was used as a finisher's time. Who knows? An oddity for sure.

Not too long after @*DisneyDreamer came through and @opusone and I cheered her through. She even came over in the finisher's chute and gave us high-fives! So cool! Gave her the apple fritter and not too long after we all separated on our own ways.

All in all a successful experience all around. It has been enjoyable to coach @roxymama for the last two years from the 5k on up. This felt like a nice moment to add to the coaching experience with helping pace one of my runners to an "A" goal. It's something I'd like to do more in the future when I can get it to work in my schedule. I'd still like to focus on me. But when I can make it work, then I'm at the ready to help another person achieve their own goal. And in a way help me achieve a goal. Like Goal # 20:

20. Pace someone I know to a PR at the 10k distance

IMG_0951.JPG
 
Milwaukee Marathon Weekend - 10k: A Coach's Perspective

If you'd like to read the runner's perspective about the race, head here (link). @roxymama did an amazing job of recapping the experience from her side. This recap is from the other side of the experience, as a coach.

This experience for me started on November 15, 2015. I had only been a DIS posting member for about a month, but in November I received a PM from another DIS member.

Title: Help getting to 8k/10k
From: @roxymama


Hi @DopeyBadger ! Would you be interested in suggesting a possible training plan for me for after my WDW 5k weekend? I can answer any questions that will help you "figure me out." Basically I have been running only 5k races this year and I have done at least one per month with a few multiple race months. It was my way of making myself a runner by setting a lot of easy to attain goals. I am running the WDW 5k in Jan but it will not be a "race" for me so I am not training for any kind of PR on that one. But I signed up for an 8k first week of April, then would like to do a 10k in May and in July I have a 5k/10k challenge. End goal is 15k & 10 miler in the fall. I'm hoping you can help me figure out how to get myself to the 10k distance as I'm a little bit lost on best way to take myself to that next distance step.
Currently I run 3 days a week. I was 100% outdoor runner until Daylight savings hit and then Tues/Thur went to treadmill at the gym with a weekend run. Now with snow on the ground I'm probably going to be a treadmill only runner until we get some thaw. I can answer any questions you have. And take your time, I really appreciate the help!


Someone was looking for my help in moving forward in their running career. She was the second person to reach out to me and ask for help. Thus, started a relationship of coach and protege that would extend the next two years leading up to the Milwaukee 10k. Transitioning from a 5k to an 8k to a 10k to a 5k/10k challenge to a 15k to a 10 miler to a HM for fun to a HM for time to a 10k for goal crushing.

The idea for a DIS local meet race came to me after Marathon Weekend 2017. I had a lot of fun putting faces to users and realized it might also be fun to do this outside a Disney race. I knew there were several users in the Chicago/Milwaukee area so I floated the idea out there on a local DIS meet race (link). The Milwaukee Marathon Weekend seemed to match up well with everyone's schedule best and it had several racing options (1 mile, 5k, 10k, HM and M). Since this race was 2 weeks after my "A" goal marathon, I knew I wasn't going to be in racing shape. After most marathons, I take two weeks off to recover and enjoy family life outside running. So, I had an idea. Since @roxymama's pace was towards the slower end of my normal pace I could probably maintain her pace for either a 10K (more likely) or a HM. We settled on the 10k and both spent the next several months training for that day.

So fast-forward to October 2017 and my marathon was over. I wrapped up my one week recovery and needed to figure out whether I was going to be able to maintain her pace for a 10k race. One of my first runs back, 4 miles @ 8:44, I received a comment on my run of "Nice pace!" from @roxymama. Now the whole time it was my intention to keep her blind to race pace. Remove the pace gremlins from the equation. So, now it became apparent she was eyeing up my training runs to gain a slight inclination as to the goal. My response, "Just trying to find my groove in case I need it...". I spent the next several runs varying the pace just to convince myself I would not be a hinderance on race day. Unfortunately, after Thursday's run my groin issue flared up again. It's been on and off since June, but it decided to be on again right before the race. I just iced it and hoped for the best. Moving forward, I've got some ideas to take care of this since it appears to be an issue that isn't going away completely.

Since there had been such a wide love for the fritters after the last couple races, I thought it would be a neat idea to bring some to the finish line for each of the other DIS runners. So Steph was able to pick some up late Saturday night after work and they were GINORMOUS! Which is how I like them. About 10 pounds of doughnut! I got one for each person so then there wouldn't have to be any fighting over the left overs. Because you can trust me when I say, once you start eating it, it's hard to stop. So sharing is usually out of the question...

@roxymama was kind enough to agree to pick-up my packet on Saturday. And that turned out to be more of a god-send than ever intended. G got sick on Saturday with throwing up, fever, sniffles, crying all day, lack of appetite... It was a rough Saturday for kiddo. So having that and packet pickup would have likely been a nightmare. Thankfully, roxymama saved the day.

This race served as a new experience for me. To date, I had run 36 official races. Only once before had the race not been about me and a time goal. Back in April 2014, I ran the Crazy Legs Classic 8k with a friend in college pacing her through her first 8k. It was a fun experience and something I knew I wanted to do more of in the future. But, I was being very selfish. I had my own goals. Which meant each race I ran was with a calculated purpose. Training was scheduled. Races were scheduled. So I spent years working on me, me, me. But this Milwaukee 10k would serve as a pivot point for future racing. I know I'm getting close to my maximum potential. Not there yet, and I'll keep squeezing the orange until I get all the juice out. But eventually, time goals will fade as I'll peak and then get older and slower. So it's always been my intention to look for other avenues to continue enjoying the sport of running. And one of those other avenues (as seen by my 102 goals) is to help pace people I know through races for PRs or other experiences like a BQ.

Race morning, I got up at 3:45am. Quickly showered, took care of the dog, and ate breakfast at 4:25am (PB/honey bagel and banana). I drank some water and that was it for consumption. Planned last bathroom break was roughly 6:30am with the belief that after meeting the HM runners they would start off on their race and us 10k'ers would head to the bathrooms. In the car by 4:35 and off we went. We actually got pretty lucky on the drive over as a deer was standing on the edge of the interstate. It would have been a disastrous outcome if it had been another 2 feet further.

Since G was sick (and quite delirious in the car), Steph and I decided she would just drop me off at the start line and then her and G would hang out at the Collectio not too far from the start. I headed to the start line and was VERY thankful that I had brought my winter coat. The wind was a beast. The weather watch all week went from rain and sorta hot, to colder and very very windy. So having the winter coat with wind breaker was a must standing out in the open. I just started heading over and was lucky enough to run into my mom on the way. She had chosen to run the 10k as well and if the weather was good was hoping for a sub-1 as well. Since there was a bit of wind, and she hates the cold for racing, it was looking like that might be a fringe goal. I had tipped her off earlier that while @roxymama and my goal was a sub-1, that I wasn't quite sure where we would end up. So she was welcome to join us, but to be aware that until we start running I couldn't be positive of the pace.

After meeting up with my mom, we ran into @opusone. Nice to finally meet you! Always fun to put a face to a person on the other side of the internet. After a few minutes, @roxymama had found us as well. Don't remember a ton of the small details of conversation, but I do remember one key part. I had seen prior when @roxymama had done blind runs roxykiddo would provide her a sticker to cover the watch face. Now since I'm DopeyBadger I felt it only appropriate to provide a sticker with the face of Bucky on it. So anytime she wanted to glance at her watch, good ole' Bucky would be staring back at her. Blind running it is for her. I wanted her to not focus on the pace but how she felt. I felt reasonably confident I knew what she was capable of. But I wanted to get a feel for it before I settled on a final goal pace. Although all along I wasn't going to tip my hand at what that pace would be. I would need to judge it based on the WU (bet you didn't guess that was a test) and a few other factors during the race. But the original goal was a 9:00 min/mile. Based on her previous race experience in June, I had her estimated 10k fitness as a 9:14 min/mile. So she completed a 15 week HM training plan between June and October. Now while the HM ended up being not representative of her fitness (way too hot of a race) I knew she had likely also improved since that June estimate. So I had her pegged for a 9:00 min/mile pace.

Not too long after @roxymama showed up, so did @*DisneyDreamer. Another person that I had helped somewhat to this point so another person I had a vested interest in seeing how she would perform on race day. She looked nervous but excited. And since she's had about the worst luck possible for races (always inclement weather of some type) we were all happy this race ended up on the colder side of the spectrum (wind not withstanding). Unfortunately, we never did run into @pixarmom but it wasn't terribly surprising since the race start area was very crowded. I was still hopeful to catch her at the end. Although, I tipped my hand a bit and told the other DIS members to keep an eye for me at the finish line because I had something for them. Didn't completely show the cards, but just come find me. It was my intention to hang around until everyone finished.

So bye to the HM'ers and off to the ports-potties went my mom, roxy, and myself. Right on schedule. I bib'ed myself (first time putting a bib on while wearing the singlet) and then we headed to the start corral. As we headed to the start, we met up with @roxyhubby and roxykiddo. It was a pleasure to meet them as well. And convincing roxykiddo that I was indeed a prince fell without success. Roxyhubby was kind enough to take my and my mother's jacket. We informed them of the coffee shop where Steph was hanging out and they headed there not long after the start. Funny side note. As you may have read from proxy's recap her husband and kid sat at a table with a woman and child. That woman and child just so happened to be the same woman and child that Steph hung out with for a few moments in another coffee shop while waiting for me to finish the Lakefront Marathon two weeks prior. And how do I know that, because Steph was sitting one table down from where roxyhubby and child sat. Yet, neither of them knew each other so they never realized they were the tag-team support group.

We were running a tad low on time, but I knew a brief WU was crucial. So I did a few stretches and then roxy and I headed to do a WU. The goal was to determine what roxy's comfortable pace was. Based on that WU I knew that the 9:00 min/mile was going to be a good place to be. I felt reasonably confident that even though I don't normally hold that specific pace, that with my watch and with my ability to internalize time, that we could hit it pretty consistently.

So we lined up at the start, and then I realized it was fairly crowded where we were standing. So I moved us up. And up. And up. Until we were about 10 people deep from the start line. Lots lots more room. I looked around at the other racers and told roxy I thought if today were a race day for me, I'd probably end up in the top 5. Just judging based on the other runners around us. No pacers, no clocks on course, and no GPS for her. Just me to rely on and trust. We came up with our code words if needed. I wanted short one word ideas to determine things on course. With a 10k, I wanted her to focus on her and not on words. Race brain and all. I also wanted her to listen to music if that's what she wanted. So we came up with Green = go faster, Red = go slower, Drink = give me the water bottle, and Lost = you're losing me. Before too long the announcer counted us down and we were off.

The first mile was all about finding that rhythm and constantly checking my watch. Roxy was side by side with me and my mom was just a tad behind us. For the first couple turns the pace said in the 8:40-9:00 range, but I was confident it was more in the 9:00 range. I felt we may have been getting a little interference with the taller buildings. As we came up on the first mile marker, my watch buzzed early at 8:43. But I was confident that it was wrong because we were a tad early. So I switched to overall time, and as we passed the first marker it was 9:00 on the dot. Throughout the first mile, there was not much of a noticeable pattern to roxy's breathing. So either we were going too slow or it was too early to figure out just yet. I decided to hold the 9 and see what mile 2 brought us.

As mile 2 was happening, I could tell roxy was picking up the breathing so I knew we were close to 10k race effort. So we settled in on the 9 pace. A few times I reached back or to the side to hand her her water bottle. Not too long after the first mile marker I saw the leader of the 5k. He seemed to be doing alright, but it confirmed to me that the gap behind him meant this would be a slower 5k finish. Indeed, if I had been able to race the 5k I would have finished in 2nd place. But that wasn't the goal today, today's goal was roxy and the sub-1 project. So we powered through mile 2. Again I felt as if we were getting some GPS interference. We hit GPS mile 2 with a split of 8:53. But I waited and when we crossed the 2 mile marker it was 18 min exactly. Still hitting that goal 9 min pace. There were a few times where roxy and I ran the tangent. And like she said in her recap it was a good teaching lesson. Don't always follow the crowd. When there's a bend in the road and it makes a "C", try instead to run the straight line of the "D". Let the others follow the bend, you follow the straightest path between corner to corner. As long as there aren't any cones dictating the course on the road, then it's within your power to make those moves legally (unless a course martial tells you differently as well). Because at the end of the day, I will always assume the race has been measured appropriately and certified by the tangent standards that I've studied.

Roxy and I did some weaving through the third mile and a few times I directed her behind me when I notices a shift in the wind. Her breathing was still good and rhythmic. A few times she would take a deep breath or the rhythm would fall and then I'd just barely slow the pace. Then once back on track we'd pick it right back up. I'm not even sure she ever noticed these micro adjustments. So yes roxy, I was paying attention to your breathing the whole time as an indicator for effort. Hit mile 3 and was close to GPS and sign matching up at 9:01. Still right on target.

After we hit mile 3, I told roxy we were just on pace. I didn't specify whose pace, but on pace. But then something strange happened. We had been clicking off the mile markers right on target each time. But this time, the mile 4 marker came up really quick. Like too quick. Like at mile 3.65 on my watch quick. So the question instantly became - short course? or misplaced marker? Now I did turn and tell roxy that it was strange to see the mile 4 marker there. She was so in the zone she never heard me, and it was probably for the best. I figured her watch was buzzing her, but never knew that it wasn't working right. So I was interested to see when the mile 5 marker came which it would end up being. Not surprisingly, the wind picked up in the opposite direction. Now for the most part we were protected because the wind was coming west to east. So since we were running mostly north to south we were safe. And because there's a hill with tall building along the coast, the western direction was blocked from wind. So we had some wind, but not the full brunt force of it. But when we did, I would just motion where roxy should go to get the best drafting. We hit mile 4 at 9:02 per my watch. Right on target.

Roxy was low on water after mile 4 so I was hoping to hit an aid station for her. But the last aid station was on the opposite side of the street. I considered jumping the street and getting some water and racing back. But decided against it. We powered up a small hill and saw a large on ramp. I joked with roxy we should go that way instead. Didn't seem to be any takers. As we came on the downhill I saw the 5 mile mark. Took a glance at the watch and saw 4.7 miles. Knew now that the course was short. Tangent running will cut some if measure inappropriately. But not this much, and not this suddenly. And so either two signs placed wrong, or short course. It became clear it was a short course. But what do I say to her? Do I tell her now? Or just keep pretending everything is fine. I decided to keep it to myself until it was much later. We came through mile 5 at 9:02.

Now I could tell from her breathing she was starting to get tired. Things were clearly getting tougher to her. So I just continued to give her encouragement. Looking strong. Great job. We're crushing it. But roxy, we're just a bit slower than goal pace. It was a lie. I knew we were going to get it easy. But I wanted to feed her a little motivation. Not sure whether she heard it, and based on her recap maybe she didn't. But I learned from the Psychobiological Model that if you manipulate amount of time running left or pace feedback you can change a person's motivational response and intensity. We powered through. When there was about 0.2 miles left, I gave her the news.

Roxy, do you care more about 6.2 miles or the finish line? Huh? Do you care more about 6.2 miles or the finish line? Huh? The course is short. We can turn now and make sure we get 6.2 miles or we can take what the course gives us and finish. I want the finish. I want the time based on the course like everyone else. Sounds good. Then we've only got about 2 minutes left so I want you to give me everything you've got.

As we approached the finish line, I kept looking back and saying they're coming they're coming. Someone is trying to beat you. I was just trying to squeeze those last few ounces of effort out of her. We crossed the finish line and we were done. She looks at me and says, what's the time? I raise up my watch and show her.... 52:49. She says, GET OUT! As she pushes me. That moment will stick with me for a while. That pure joy and elation on her face for accomplishing her goal. But she didn't just accomplish it, SHE CRUSHED IT! An official PR of 1:05. An unofficial PR of 1:02. And here we stand, with no pace gremlins, with good but not ideal race conditions and we've got a 52:49. Now, the bad news. The course was short. It was only 5.9 miles. Some of it tangents, but somewhere a missed turn. As roxy stated, the course was short. No more proof needed than my Strava map vs official map:

Official

View attachment 277296

Mine
View attachment 277295

Missing stretch by satellite measurement:

View attachment 277297

So we lost about 0.5 miles because of the turn too early. I measure us at 5.9 miles + 0.5 miles leads to a 6.4 mile race. Now I had assumed that a 10k is not always 6.22 miles by GPS. Just happens because of tangents and GPS inaccuracy, so the goal had always been to run a pace at 6.4 miles that I knew would still be sub-1 (9:22 min/mile or better). Who knows what went wrong? Just based on the satellite image there's no break in the median where the official course shows the turn so I'm not sure what their intention was ever going to be there.

http://www.usatf.org/events/courses...tionYear=&lastName=&format=view&submit=Search

View attachment 277301

Based on the description on the certification, it was suppose to be further up than that intersection. So yes, it was a short course per your own certification Milwaukee...

Regardless, we got the goal. Well under sub-1 to leave no doubt in my mind that even on a 6.22 mile course or 6.4 mile course we were clear. Estimated 6.22 based on pace was 55:40, well under goal. And also set a new 5k PR of 27:37 during the race. Kudos roxy! We met up with our families and exchanged congrats. @rteetz found us and we were all happy with the outcome. Roxy broke out her surprise of a "Coach's Whistle" and I broke out my surprise of Apple Fritters. Everyone felt satisfied. rteetz and roxy headed out and I stuck around until my mom came through the finish. Then she left, and I waited for @opusone to finish. It was fun to see him cross the line and then surprise him with his own apple fritter. We headed up to the finish line hopeful to catch @pixarmom. Somehow, I never saw her finish even though I was standing there.

Then @opusone left to go get a jacket while I waited for @*DisneyDreamer to cross the line. Did see a bit of weirdness. Quite a few purple bibs (marathons) came across quite early. Most seemed to have just turned at the HM mark. But one in particular stuck out. A guy dressed in a Brewers uniform came just a few minutes behind the winner of the marathon (2:22). He did not look appropriately dressed for a sub 2:30 marathon. Just before the finish line he stopped and took a bib out of his pocket and handed to a spectator. It was a purple marathon bib. He crossed the line without a bib on, but when he crossed they announced the name of David Luy. He shows up as a 2:23 Marathon finish. I looked up David Luy in Athlinks from WI and found a few results. A 2:25 HM from May and a 3:32 Ironman 70.3 from July. I'm not going to delve any further than that. I saw the guy later with @opusone and he had a blue finisher's so he took the HM medal. But he had a purple bib, so he clearly opted to end early. My guess is that his bib was picked up by the "name" timing mat (used to announce people) and was used as a finisher's time. Who knows? An oddity for sure.

Not too long after @*DisneyDreamer came through and @opusone and I cheered her through. She even came over in the finisher's chute and gave us high-fives! So cool! Gave her the apple fritter and not too long after we all separated on our own ways.

All in all a successful experience all around. It has been enjoyable to coach @roxymama for the last two years from the 5k on up. This felt like a nice moment to add to the coaching experience with helping pace one of my runners to an "A" goal. It's something I'd like to do more in the future when I can get it to work in my schedule. I'd still like to focus on me. But when I can make it work, then I'm at the ready to help another person achieve their own goal. And in a way help me achieve a goal. Like Goal # 20:

20. Pace someone I know to a PR at the 10k distance

View attachment 277309
I thought it was short while running. My watch didn’t seem to match the mile markers and several other runners around me took notice. Oh well, I can say I PR’d in 5.9 miles ;)
 


I've never done a dual perspective recap so I was hoping my take wasn't wildly off base compared to how you felt it went, haha!
I had to take notes for my response so I wouldn't leave anything out. Sorry if this is disjointed, I was just answering stuff you wrote as I read.

Two years is a lot of miles! What's the proper run-friend 2 yr gift? Paper? E-gels? Strava data???
I cringed when I saw you had the old email from back when I first asked for help because I couldn't remember what I'd said. But then I didn't say anything too embarrassing, so it's ok. I can't believe how "sure" I was about my goal progression back then and that I eventually did all that. Because I can fully remember how terrified I was of 5 miles runs way back then!!

I had no idea you were having any groin issues again leading up the run. I hope that you figure it out because, OUCH! Feel better!!!

So you/Steph carried at least five 10 lbs fritters? That weighs more than my daughter! I still haven't completely finished off mine because I still wanted to eat some tonight. So I have a small bit of will power. (very small)

Sorry to hear about GiGi being so sick. Roxykiddo had a bad case of maybe eating bad chili from school/maybe a flu bug back a few weekends ago which freaked me out. Hope she feels better. And that is a coincidence that they were sitting so close at the coffee shop.

I didn't even think to over-analyze our warm-up. I obviously gotta get into the mind of the badger better! I was in the "nervous" mode and doing a warmup was what I mentally needed. Funny that I didn't have my sticker on my watch yet so I could've though to cheat and peak during the WU, but I didn't. It was a fun moment to say "hey we are running together finally" because it's been literally months we'd been talking about it.

I did want to mention that since I understand being competitive...it was very nice of you to forfeit a potential podium or age group for me. I've never sniffed one, but if I were at a race where I had the potential to get an award it would be so tempting. So thanks for that!!!

Re the tangents...now I definitely know that just blindly hugging the nearest sidewalk to the next turn isn't always the shortest route.

I did notice little speed shifts here and there, but I didn't know if it was me falling off and catching back up or you purposely giving me a breather or purposely giving me a push. But either way I was hellbent on keeping you at least a certain distance from me. I did every once in awhile think "ok, but don't trip him or accidentally knock him over!!"

I realized "no mile buzzes" but didn't say anything. I thought I'd rather just not know at that point. Figured I'd have to run hard for a 10k whether I knew how much I had left or not.

And I could totally also tell from my breathing at the end that I was working harder!! I'm trying to break my mouth breathing habit when things get speedy or hard. I do mantras from yoga in my head all the time. In through the nose, out through the mouth, relax, etc.

I actually did hear many of the things you said! I also heard when that one guy was asking where you were from. My face probably was reading pretty blank as I was super concentrating on just keeping the body moving. I tend to get more brain-duh the closer I am to a finish line. When you said the thing about someone coming I literally looked to my left like "where?" Haha, brain fart. But I did sprint (well as best I could) so I got the general idea.

I've since read on some posts on FB that the half was the right distance and some people think the full had a mile 22 course issue. Which to me is a bigger bummer than a short 10k course. So I hope no one gets like a BQ or something cut short.

Thanks so much again!! Maybe I'll have to use some of these pacing methods on some of my family/friends one of these days.
 
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I loved reading this from the coach perspective! I'm so glad that everyone got apple fritters (hopefully you saved one for yourself) it was well deserved post-race. Congrats on completing goal 20 and your whistle!
 


Loved your recap from Coach's Perspective! Happy that you were able to attain your goal #20!

She looks at me and says, what's the time? I raise up my watch and show her.... 52:49. She says, GET OUT! As she pushes me.
Love this! [Also reminds me of Seinfeld teehee!]

Thank you again for all you do for our running community.
 
I've since read on some posts on FB that the half was the right distance and some people think the full had a mile 22 course issue. Which to me is a bigger bummer than a short 10k course.

I agree that the half marathon seemed to be the correct distance.
 
Loved this whole recap. Congratulations on meeting another goal, and thank you for all you do for all of us.

Thanks! I'm happy to be of service. One down and 101 to go!

I thought it was short while running. My watch didn’t seem to match the mile markers and several other runners around me took notice. Oh well, I can say I PR’d in 5.9 miles ;)

Oh well, we can always extrapolate to 6.22 miles and say that's what we would have done.

Excellent coach's perspective recap! Congrats on crossing a goal off your list. :D

Thanks!

I've never done a dual perspective recap so I was hoping my take wasn't wildly off base compared to how you felt it went, haha!

I know. It's like a behind the scenes tour. Like you already know some of the stuff, but here's the rest you didn't know. To be honest, I was just going to link your race report and say, there's mine too. But the more I thought about it, the more I felt like it would be neat to here both sides of the same story.

Two years is a lot of miles! What's the proper run-friend 2 yr gift? Paper? E-gels? Strava data???

Red whistle!

I cringed when I saw you had the old email from back when I first asked for help because I couldn't remember what I'd said. But then I didn't say anything too embarrassing, so it's ok. I can't believe how "sure" I was about my goal progression back then and that I eventually did all that. Because I can fully remember how terrified I was of 5 miles runs way back then!!

Don't worry. I was ready to edit when necessary.

I had no idea you were having any groin issues again leading up the run. I hope that you figure it out because, OUCH! Feel better!!!

I didn't want to concern you with it. I was (somewhat) confident it wouldn't be an issue so best to keep it under wraps until a later time. I think I just need to bring back my medicine ball workout. I've isolated carrying the water bottle as the reason for the hip pain (after several years). So know I can bring things back into the fold, things that were helping me stay healthy like the MBW.

So you/Steph carried at least five 10 lbs fritters? That weighs more than my daughter! I still haven't completely finished off mine because I still wanted to eat some tonight. So I have a small bit of will power. (very small)

So I just weighed it and they're two pounds each. So 12 pounds of fritters, since we had 6 of them. One for everyone including @pixarmom.

Sorry to hear about GiGi being so sick. Roxykiddo had a bad case of maybe eating bad chili from school/maybe a flu bug back a few weekends ago which freaked me out. Hope she feels better. And that is a coincidence that they were sitting so close at the coffee shop.

She's definitely feeling better and it was funny when Steph mentioned it to me later how close they were to sitting together.

I didn't even think to over-analyze our warm-up. I obviously gotta get into the mind of the badger better! I was in the "nervous" mode and doing a warmup was what I mentally needed. Funny that I didn't have my sticker on my watch yet so I could've though to cheat and peak during the WU, but I didn't. It was a fun moment to say "hey we are running together finally" because it's been literally months we'd been talking about it.

:D

I did want to mention that since I understand being competitive...it was very nice of you to forfeit a potential podium or age group for me. I've never sniffed one, but if I were at a race where I had the potential to get an award it would be so tempting. So thanks for that!!!

On a good day, sure I could have been up there. But you certainly didn't hold me back from anything because I wasn't in 5k/10k race shape. No AG or podium sights on that day.

Re the tangents...now I definitely know that just blindly hugging the nearest sidewalk to the next turn isn't always the shortest route.

::yes::

I did notice little speed shifts here and there, but I didn't know if it was me falling off and catching back up or you purposely giving me a breather or purposely giving me a push. But either way I was hellbent on keeping you at least a certain distance from me. I did every once in awhile think "ok, but don't trip him or accidentally knock him over!!"

Don't worry, I could "feel" you behind me.

I realized "no mile buzzes" but didn't say anything. I thought I'd rather just not know at that point. Figured I'd have to run hard for a 10k whether I knew how much I had left or not.

True!

And I could totally also tell from my breathing at the end that I was working harder!! I'm trying to break my mouth breathing habit when things get speedy or hard. I do mantras from yoga in my head all the time. In through the nose, out through the mouth, relax, etc.

I'm pretty sure that was your maximum for that day just based on the factors I could see. As far as breathing, I actually thought you did really well. I wouldn't change much. If you can do nose breathing then more power to you. I certainly can't for as many times as I've tried to make it habit.

I actually did hear many of the things you said! I also heard when that one guy was asking where you were from. My face probably was reading pretty blank as I was super concentrating on just keeping the body moving.

Yea, that guy was funny and then he didn't want to talk anymore. A 5k/10k race is usually not the place you find people chatting just because of the effort level when at race pace.

I tend to get more brain-duh the closer I am to a finish line. When you said the thing about someone coming I literally looked to my left like "where?" Haha, brain fart. But I did sprint (well as best I could) so I got the general idea.

LOL, no worries. I knew that's what was happening. Tunnel vision.

some people think the full had a mile 22 course issue.

Annoying.

Thanks so much again!! Maybe I'll have to use some of these pacing methods on some of my family/friends one of these days.

No problem. It was a lot of fun!

Loved reading this from both perspectives!! Congrats! :)

Thanks!

I loved reading this from the coach perspective! I'm so glad that everyone got apple fritters (hopefully you saved one for yourself) it was well deserved post-race. Congrats on completing goal 20 and your whistle!

Thanks! There's no way I was buying those for everyone else and not myself. I mean let's be real.

Loved your recap from Coach's Perspective! Happy that you were able to attain your goal #20!


Love this! [Also reminds me of Seinfeld teehee!]

Thank you again for all you do for our running community.

Thanks! Total Seinfeld moment. Same thing I thought too.

I agree that the half marathon seemed to be the correct distance.

Well that's good. A broken clock is right two times a day I guess. Here's hoping they figure out that correct courses matter a ton to runners.
 
Hey, congrats on your race @opusone !!! I was already headed back to my hotel with my kiddo when you finished. Sorry that I missed you at the end. Did you get near the time you were hoping for?

I had revised my goal to be 1:45, and I finished 1:45:26, so it was close. I definitely would have made it without the 20-22 mph wind, but you gotta take the race conditions you’re given.
 
Got a survey for the Milwaukee Marathon and let them know how I felt about their 10k course. Gave them my name and email if they wanted to explain to me what happened. Not expecting anything really, but just wanted to let them know why I chose to race that particular 10k (or any race for that matter).
 
Got a survey for the Milwaukee Marathon and let them know how I felt about their 10k course. Gave them my name and email if they wanted to explain to me what happened. Not expecting anything really, but just wanted to let them know why I chose to race that particular 10k (or any race for that matter).
Got the survey as well but haven't done it yet.
 
Checking my email...ok, I just got one too.

Will you let us know if they respond to you about the course length (and vice versa if they respond to me I'll update y'all.)

I will probably also say that I loved the design of the finisher shirt but I wished it had all the distances on it so I could show it off.
 
I loved the old name - Milwaukee Running Festival!! It was festive, and it was kind of "in theme" with all the Milwaukee festivals. I'd also like for them to put the expo back in the Harley event center instead of throwing us into that tent. And I'd like for them to display merch on racks at the expo so that we can actually shop instead of tacking it up on the wall - I might have bought something if they did. Completely agree on the shirt. Also, the shirt is too busy for me - so much stuff on there! And please, please, please add mile markers for every mile!! (Maybe Qdoba could give them burrito themed mile markers instead of handing out burritos the day before to mile runners!!)

They get tons of points for a really great half marathon course, bouncy houses at the end for the kids and all the chocolate milk!!
 

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