Government Again Concedes Vaccines Cause Autism

[Forevryoung]

So what is the next step? I don't believe the next step is continuing to argue about the autism/vaccine link.

Ignoring the autism/vaccine link is not going to do a thing to reduce the number of children with a diagnosis.

And arguing it for the next 5, 10, 15, 20+ years is going to reduce the number of children WITH a diagnosis???

 

[Beccabunny]

Schmeck, the special masters are the "vaccine court" judges. Health and Human Services sets up a vaccine injury fund to protect the manufacturers against liability, then the injured bring their claims against HHS, and HHS gets to decide for or against itself.

Bookwormde, I don't think we're talking about the same kind of autism. I'm not talking about exceptional giftedness or some social quirkiness. I think most would agree that's not new. And I'm not downplaying Asperger's, because the many individuals I know with that diagnosis face immense challenges, even if they have come to appreciate their strengths. I'm talking about the kind of autism that involves horrible GI issues, numerous infections running through the bloodstream, phantom fevers that appear out of nowhere and then disappear, self injury, seriously low muscle tone, mitochondrial disorders, and seizures. I don't believe this was the norm in kids with autism twenty or thirty years ago.

My daughter was not born with any "neurovariant." She was a healthy infant who laughed, sought out interaction with her family, played games, and said a few words. She regressed with each round of vaccines, first with her motor skills and then socially and verbally. By fifteen months she had a diagnosis of global developmental delay, and at age three she got the PDD-NOS diagnosis.

At this point I'm almost ready to start playing HHS's word games. It's time to stop calling it autism, and instead call it vaccine injury resulting in autism-like symptoms.

 

[Beccabunny]

Forevryoung, do you have a solution? What do you suggest? We're screening early, we're getting kids into early intervention, but that is not preventing autism. We can pour tons of money into education, but it's not going to reverse the damage.

We shouldn't HAVE to argue the vaccine-autism connection. But until there is a well-designed study of vaccinated/unvaccinated populations that is not paid for and conducted by Pharma shills, the questions will remain. It's not going away. Same with studies of vaccines in combination shots. No study has EVER been done on the safety of the various vaccines in combination with each other. Again, until this is done, the questions will remain. The entire vaccine program is in jeopardy because parents are losing their trust in their doctors and their government. If you don't like it, push for honest research that will answer the questions.

As for what can be done for the children with a diagnosis, well, parents like myself find we're pretty much on our own. I've been extremely blessed. I have found biomedical treatments that have worked well for my daughter, and at age nine she is making real and dramatic progress. Not everyone responds this well, but most parents will never know what is possible for their children if they keep listening to the mainstream medical establishment.

 

[bookwormde]

In 10 or 15 year when the gene set is mapped I believe you will be surprised to find that she has the same gene set as the rest of the people with who are on the spectrum. It is not at all unusual for there to be virtually no indications of autism characteristics well past the age of 1 (the best clinical minds in the Autism field can not usually diagnose a major portion of individuals who are on the spectrum at this age) and for higher functioning it may not show up until 4-6 years old as the requirements of societal social interaction become more demanding. All the physiological issues you describe are not Autism spectrum characteristics but are separate issues (some of which may be effected by the neurovariations, particularly the sensory ones, such as diet issues or muscle tone,), they are however indication of severe toxicity either from contamination or reaction to something else (like a vaccine). Separating the genetic spectrum variations from the cognitive and other physiological issues is difficult even for clinicians unless they are very current and highly experienced with all aspects of the Autism spectrum.

It is all one spectrum; it is just impacted by a myriad of other factors that make the manifestation so diverse.

It is great that you have found effective treatment for the physiological difficulties you daughter has had, but it is important to remember that they only have a second level effect on her needs when it comes to the core autism gene set. I would like to tell you that getting supports and therapies for that side of the equation is easy but it is not as I am sure you and all the other parents of children on the spectrum (both diagnosed and undiagnosed) have found.

Again you can prevent the Autistic characteristic from developing to clinically diagnosable levels but you do not prevent them they are part of what the person is not something they have.

bookwormde

 

[Schmeck]

Schmeck, the special masters are the "vaccine court" judges. Health and Human Services sets up a vaccine injury fund to protect the manufacturers against liability, then the injured bring their claims against HHS, and HHS gets to decide for or against itself.

There are judges who are just sitting on these types of cases? Are they medical doctors as well as judges? Because if they are just called 'special masters' because they have been sitting on these cases so long, there's nothing special or mastered about them.

 

[BlondeAlligator]

My DD age 6 has autism. She was vaccinated. I get so tried of this debate because I see autism as a part of who she is, not a disease she has. I also know of a set of identical twins, both of whom were vaccinated with the same vaccines on the same days their whole childhood...one has autism and the other does not. Same DNA, same vaccines...how do you explain that one? One would think that they should both have autism if you subscribe to the vaccine damage theory; the vaccine should have affected their genes the same way. I think that autism is a mystery, and parents who have children with autism often want to find someone to blame. As for me, I realized a long time ago that the "why" it happened to my DD is not as important as the "how" of making the rest of her life the best it can be.

I certainly hope that we don't see a return of devastating illnesses like polio because of the attempts of many to blame vaccinations.

 

[BeckyScott]

Oh goody goody, nothing like a little debate to go with my morning coffee.

This is what I think, as if anyone cares: there is more than one cause. There is more than one treatment.

The kids are born with a genetic predisposition, and then there is an external trigger.

Everyone so busy arguing, nobody doing anything.

If someone manufactures a product that the public won't buy, then the manufacturer either needs to change the product or they'll go out of business. Unless you're a pharma, then the solution is to keep your product the same, but try to make parents look like idiots and spend tons of money on PR, to the point of the government trying to mandate that people buy your product. And they really do have a PR problem, because every time I've seen one of the govt/pharma/CDC types on tv, they act pretty arrogant. Arrogant is not the way to win friends. And the parents don't know who to believe- the arrogant CDC PR guy, or the mom with her son telling the story while her child sits rocking and flapping.

The whole thing now is a matter of trust. Who do you trust more. Some of us trust science, because it's science. Some of us trust other parents, because we think they are less biased. We used to trust the government, but it's not just the vaccine issue, and if you can't trust them for one thing why should you trust them for something else? This is the same government that gave us the bailout package, Monica Lewinsky, Watergate, Area 51...

All I can hope, and I do hope, is that future generations will look back on us now and say "How could they have not seen this? What were they thinking?" It's unfortunate that this generation is the one caught in the middle and that our children are the victims in a tug-of-war. It's not about them anymore, it's about ego, on both sides, it's about being right instead of finding the truth.

 

[jodifla]

I work with preschoolers.

I spoke to a parent on Friday. She went to a Kindergarten "lunch" for her son (he receives speech services but will be discharged before K). She was told that there are 500 incoming kindergarteners. 190 of them have been diagnosed on the spectrum.

I live in the district that she is talking about. It's an area where the services are known to be great and the taxes are very high (talking $18,000 a year for property taxes for the smallest house on the block).

So what is the next step? I don't believe the next step is continuing to argue about the autism/vaccine link.

And if we are going to talk about the Amish, you do realize that they have a small gene pool?????? (in comparison to the rest of the world)

Rampant overdiagnosing by schools is a lot of the autism "epidemic." In reality, I've seen a statistic where as many as 60 percent of kids are being labeled inaccurately, partly because they are being labeled too early, partly because the "diagnosers" aren't following clinical protocol.

 

[jodifla]

Oh goody goody, nothing like a little debate to go with my morning coffee.

This is what I think, as if anyone cares: there is more than one cause. There is more than one treatment.

The kids are born with a genetic predisposition, and then there is an external trigger.

Everyone so busy arguing, nobody doing anything.

If someone manufactures a product that the public won't buy, then the manufacturer either needs to change the product or they'll go out of business. Unless you're a pharma, then the solution is to keep your product the same, but try to make parents look like idiots and spend tons of money on PR, to the point of the government trying to mandate that people buy your product. And they really do have a PR problem, because every time I've seen one of the govt/pharma/CDC types on tv, they act pretty arrogant. Arrogant is not the way to win friends. And the parents don't know who to believe- the arrogant CDC PR guy, or the mom with her son telling the story while her child sits rocking and flapping.

The whole thing now is a matter of trust. Who do you trust more. Some of us trust science, because it's science. Some of us trust other parents, because we think they are less biased. We used to trust the government, but it's not just the vaccine issue, and if you can't trust them for one thing why should you trust them for something else? This is the same government that gave us the bailout package, Monica Lewinsky, Watergate, Area 51...

All I can hope, and I do hope, is that future generations will look back on us now and say "How could they have not seen this? What were they thinking?" It's unfortunate that this generation is the one caught in the middle and that our children are the victims in a tug-of-war. It's not about them anymore, it's about ego, on both sides, it's about being right instead of finding the truth.

Of course, the thing is, vaccines, LIKE ALL MEDICINES, have a danger factor to them. My birth control pills came with a whole brochure of doom every month....and they are very bad for some women. GREAT for the rest of us.

Every time my son got a vaccine, I got a list of the warnings.

I'm 47, and know of a man in his late 50s/early 60s who got polio from the vaccine. Smallpox is a very tricky and dangerous vaccine.

But thiose diseases are largely WIPED OUT now, THANKS to VACCINES. And THANKS TO OUR PARENTS who got those vaccines.

 

[BeckyScott]

Jodi, I'm not saying it's vaccines or it's not vaccines. I'm just saying that the damage control by the CDC has (so far) consisted of a group of fairly arrogant people doing officially-read press releases, and some attempts to encroach upon parental rights.

I have to admit, I have a very very low threshold for people that do the Silly Mommy Eye Roll with me. And the thing is, I think most parents with children with disabilities have that same low threshold, and lots of "professionals" don't seem to notice or care. The way to win them over is not to treat them like they're stupid. So when I see someone "official" on tv doing the tv version of the Silly Mommy Eye Roll, I immediately absolutely don't believe a word they say. The message is lost. Answer the question, don't skip around it. Treat the client with respect. I don't care if I walk into the doctor's office and tell them my kid has autism because he was abducted by aliens, I expect to be heard. If they're so smart, why haven't they figured it out by now?

my quote

All I can hope, and I do hope, is that future generations will look back on us now and say "How could they have not seen this? What were they thinking?"

is more like the answer is somewhere right under our noses, no matter what it is, it's right there and we aren't seeing it. At this point I don't know what causes it-- I'd be happy to share the answer if I knew it-- so many theories, shot down one by one, no answers.

Interesting thoughts about the Amish, though. I wonder what the most current up-to-date statistic would show, or even how truly accurate it would be considering that the Amish would tend towards more "alternative medicine" per se, and maybe not as likely to go thru an extensive mainstream evaluation. Even the Amish, try though they may to stay seperate, are still exposed to some things that we've tossed into their world. Maybe not the vaccines. Maybe the preservatives, the chemicals, contaminates in the ground or the water supply.

 

[jodifla]

Jodi, I'm not saying it's vaccines or it's not vaccines. I'm just saying that the damage control by the CDC has (so far) consisted of a group of fairly arrogant people doing officially-read press releases, and some attempts to encroach upon parental rights.

I have to admit, I have a very very low threshold for people that do the Silly Mommy Eye Roll with me. And the thing is, I think most parents with children with disabilities have that same low threshold, and lots of "professionals" don't seem to notice or care. The way to win them over is not to treat them like they're stupid. So when I see someone "official" on tv doing the tv version of the Silly Mommy Eye Roll, I immediately absolutely don't believe a word they say. The message is lost. Answer the question, don't skip around it. Treat the client with respect. I don't care if I walk into the doctor's office and tell them my kid has autism because he was abducted by aliens, I expect to be heard. If they're so smart, why haven't they figured it out by now?

my quote is more like the answer is somewhere right under our noses, no matter what it is, it's right there and we aren't seeing it. At this point I don't know what causes it-- I'd be happy to share the answer if I knew it-- so many theories, shot down one by one, no answers.

Interesting thoughts about the Amish, though. I wonder what the most current up-to-date statistic would show, or even how truly accurate it would be considering that the Amish would tend towards more "alternative medicine" per se, and maybe not as likely to go thru an extensive mainstream evaluation. Even the Amish, try though they may to stay seperate, are still exposed to some things that we've tossed into their world. Maybe not the vaccines. Maybe the preservatives, the chemicals, contaminates in the ground or the water supply.

I agree that parents need to be treated with respect. They know their kids best!

But I'm not sure what the CDC could possibly say or do to appease people. Vaccines do great things for the majority. And for individuals, they can be quite bad. The original study that brought this up was VERY flawed and it's not been replicated since.

You I see American getting bought out by big pharma. But Denmark? All those other socialist countries?

http://www.medicine.ox.ac.uk/bandolier/booth/Vaccines/MMRDen.html