EPCOT to become “more Disney”

[maverik85]

I'm honestly all for IP. That's what makes Disney "Disney" to us. I think Epcot can still maintain a unique feel, even with increased IP.

I feel the same. It's what families want more when they go and helps to appeal to the kids more. It was my least favorite park as a kid because outside o a couple attractions I was bored. I wanted to go on rides while there. As an adult I appreciate it much more. But I think if they can find a good balance between IPs and representing the culture of different countries it will be good. Adding in characters and new rides that fit within the country (like with Ratatouille in France) while keeping the rest of what is there and don't overdo the IP it will be good. Like keep most of the shows and films as is just add on. Especially with all of the extra plots of land they have, doesn't seem like they will get a new country anytime soon anyway so use them to expand the countries with new rides to give people more to do around there.

 

[New Mouse]

Making everything generic and having 4 "Disney" parks isnt going to make them more popular. At some poimt you just start competing with yourself.

Epcot didnt seem to have a problem as they were the second highest park for attendance and well above other parks in general without much Disney for decades.

Will Disney drive attendance there? No good rides and experiences will.

Is the point to make everything a Disney commercial? That sounds miserable.

 

[LovesTimone]

Epcot has always been a struggle for little ones , that's exactly what they're trying to do but don't expect the party aspect to go away, if anything it's increasing. By them adding food and drinks to every festival they signal they make tons of money from it. Do you remember when flower and garden and the holidays didn't have food kiosks? Those are recent additions, maybe 5-10 years ago they figured out the potential money maker in adding food and wine to every festival.

Yes, I remember when they did not have food and beverage kiosks, for the festivals... I think that they did have special offerings, in the permanent kiosks, or like a special drink or snacks, or even at the QS... its been so long ago, Its hard to remember...

Epcot needs to find a balance, so that families with kids feel good about going into the park in the evening and enjoying what it has to offer...

I think that what they are planning is going to be great, and I am excited to see what they have in store for all of us... we have to wait and see...

For me the main problem is that they have to figure out how to control and stop serving overly intoxicated or wasted guests... if one booth turns them down, they can just walk over to another one, and try their luck there... which is a hard task to even wrap your head around, I do think that somethings needs to be done to curtail this...

I will say for the most part, most people are out just enjoying the offerings and options, that the festivals bring...It is a fun atmosphere and we really enjoy it... DH and I uber back and forth if we are going to enjoy adult beverages... You don't want to come on vacation on leave on probation or worse...

 

[New Mouse]

I think people are missing the boat here. Families with kids struggle at Epcot because they havent kept the park updated over the years, period. It has nothing to do with a lack of Disney IP.

 

[hertamaniac]

Like keep most of the shows and films as is just add on. Especially with all of the extra plots of land they have, doesn't seem like they will get a new country anytime soon anyway so use them to expand the countries with new rides to give people more to do around there.

They should still have the room for the infamous Germany boat ride that was part of the original plan. I'm still mystified why that was never made.

 

[Alicefan]

Exactly. I am nostalgic for Mr. Toad’s Wild Ride because that’s what I grew up with.

Now it’s Pooh. If/when they ever change Pooh to something else, my kids will be nostalgic for Pooh - one of their very favorite rides at MK.

While there are many things I love and truly miss from the parks from when I was growing up, I think it is exciting to watch the parks evolve. There are many things they have added or changed over time that I think have made a positive difference. Doesn’t mean I don’t miss the old favorites!

I just wish they would add to and not take away from. I thought that was the whole point of buying all that land in Orlando.

 

[MickeyWaffles]

I just wish they would add to and not take away from. I thought that was the whole point of buying all that land in Orlando.

No, legacy imagineers like Tony Baxter, Marty Sklar and Bob Weis have discussed this openly and at length. The parks are not museums and one of Walt’s visions was that the parks not stay stagnant - that they constantly improve. The parks are like clay - when something isn’t working anymore, it can be molded and evolve into something else.

Epcot was neglected for far too long. They let it collect dust. They let pavilions go far too long without updates. People may disagree with the changes, adding more IP, evolving identity, but things were never supposed to just stay stagnant there as long as they did. I love old Epcot, but it is long overdue for a refresh. In my opinion, of course.

 

[JC1984]

I am really enjoying all the discussion on here a lot of great points of views. Let’s keep it going!

 

[Marthasor]

I think people are missing the boat here. Families with kids struggle at Epcot because they havent kept the park updated over the years, period. It has nothing to do with a lack of Disney IP.

I'm totally with you. My DS thoroughly enjoyed the hands-on activities. He could not care less if Mickey or Groot were involved.

They should still have the room for the infamous Germany boat ride that was part of the original plan. I'm still mystified why that was never made.

And the Mt. Fuji roller coaster!!!

 

[Farro]

I'm totally with you. My DS thoroughly enjoyed the hands-on activities. He could not care less if Mickey or Groot were involved.



And the Mt. Fuji roller coaster!!!

Well, we were supposed to be getting the Play Pavilion which I would imagine would have a bunch of hands on activities for kids.

Not sure about it now though....

 

[mshanson3121]

Yes, I remember when they did not have food and beverage kiosks, for the festivals... I think that they did have special offerings, in the permanent kiosks, or like a special drink or snacks, or even at the QS... its been so long ago, Its hard to remember...

Epcot needs to find a balance, so that families with kids feel good about going into the park in the evening and enjoying what it has to offer...

I think that what they are planning is going to be great, and I am excited to see what they have in store for all of us... we have to wait and see...

For me the main problem is that they have to figure out how to control and stop serving overly intoxicated or wasted guests... if one booth turns them down, they can just walk over to another one, and try their luck there... which is a hard task to even wrap your head around, I do think that somethings needs to be done to curtail this...

I will say for the most part, most people are out just enjoying the offerings and options, that the festivals bring...It is a fun atmosphere and we really enjoy it... DH and I uber back and forth if we are going to enjoy adult beverages... You don't want to come on vacation on leave on probation or worse...

Agree. I really want to explore the WS at night, but have no interest in taking my kids to what is basically a drunken party. I agree with another poster that this is exactly why Walt never wanted alcohol in the parks and it's sad they let it turn into this. But how do you change it? Adding IP won't do anything, people who are so inconsiderate to walk around drunk in a family theme park are going to do so with or without IP.

 

[umichigan10]

I don’t trust Chapek to not shove IP wherever he feels and keep the themes of the 4 parks unique in their own way. That being said, somethings needed to be done with Epcot for over 20 years. I just hope things stay cohesive to whatever themes they go with

 

[NickC]

I used to get upset at announcements by WDW. I was firmly in the camp that was against buying franchises and using the IP in the parks. I've taken a step back recently. Ultimately, we will keep going, and if we decide that the 'magic' is gone, we'll just stop going. It would be sad because we love going, but there are other places we can visit.

But, I will say that my kids LOVE Epcot, especially WS. Even when they were 5 and 7. They love the KidCot stations, collecting passport stamps and talking to people from all over the world. They like the stores, mostly in the China pavilion, but also Norway and Mexico. They like the food. They like the snacks. They even like the films. We've done Agent P a few times, pressed pennies, watched the performers, etc. There is so much there for kids and families already.

In regards to drunkeness, we haven't really seen that. However, we've always avoided the festivals due to the crowds. But, I don't see them going away since they are great money maker. This change feels more like an IP invasion.

 

[kkbookmom]

I am really enjoying all the discussion on here a lot of great points of views. Let’s keep it going!

Me too! I tend to be a lurker but this convo is very interesting.

If I'm going to add my two cents - Epcot was always my favorite park from the time it opened. Mostly because of the "idea" behind it. Although I do wax nostalgic for experiences that are no longer around, I agree with those who fall back on Mr. Disney himself and his view that nothing should remain stagnant. My hope is that Imagineers find a happy balance between the old and the new where families find more options.

Example: My sister had a picture on a Leave a Legacy pillar. I was worried when they announced changes to that area. Mostly because my sister was my Disney trip buddy, she has now passed, and it has become part of my ritual when visiting Epcot to go "say hi" first, then start my day. I was upset that this ritual was threatened. Faced my own words above and it hurt. But now that I am seeing pictures of the results of the changes.... I'm so excited to go see the new version in person. They are beautiful. My only wish now is that my sister is in a purple section (her fav color).

 

[JC1984]

And the Mt. Fuji roller coaster!!!

Did you know WDW advertised in the 90s to bring a Swiss pavilion with the Matterhorn!?

 

[Lumpy1106]

I think people who long for the "original" EPCOT maybe don't remember it or never experienced it. It was certainly different; imagine no Test Track, Soarin', or Mission: Space. I absolutely loved World of Motion and Horizons but it wasn't enough. It's not that Disney wasn't trying, it's that the model didn't work. There were only so many large corporations and countries that wanted to sponsor the different attractions and they only had so much of a vested interest to continue funding the attractions as the years went on. The Disney way is synergy and always has been. You may not like the Frozen overlay, but that overlay sells the Frozen franchise, and draws in the kids that already love it. That has more value to Disney than keeping the ride based on Norway, and Norway isn't paying for the ride going forward - Disney is. No kid is walking into EPCOT thinking, "boy, I sure would like to know a lot more about Norwegian culture", and racing over to the Norway pavilion to get their fill. For Frozen though, the race was on at rope drop, as was the character meet-and-greet next door.

The other thing I think you are going to see dramatically reduced, if not eliminated is the extensive pre and post ride experiences. Sure, you could spend an hour waiting to ride Test Track, but you could spend another hour going through the exhibits after the ride. The only direct benefit Disney sees from that is the gift shop right before you leave the building. Test Track, Mission: Space and Spaceship Earth all have sponsors that pay for those spaces (or at least they did pre-COVID) but I think Disney would much rather you moved on to the gift shop and on to the next attraction. Could be when the sponsor contract is up, you'll see those spaces change too.

 

[JC1984]

Also maybe a 3 drink limit at EPCOT? They could do it pretty easily by scanning a ticket or AP.

 

[Moliphino]

Also maybe a 3 drink limit at EPCOT? They could do it pretty easily by scanning a ticket or AP.

No way, they make waaaay too much money on alcohol sales.

 

[JC1984]

I think people who long for the "original" EPCOT maybe don't remember it or never experienced it. It was certainly different; imagine no Test Track, Soarin', or Mission: Space. I absolutely loved World of Motion and Horizons but it wasn't enough. It's not that Disney wasn't trying, it's that the model didn't work. There were only so many large corporations and countries that wanted to sponsor the different attractions and they only had so much of a vested interest to continue funding the attractions as the years went on. The Disney way is synergy and always has been. You may not like the Frozen overlay, but that overlay sells the Frozen franchise, and draws in the kids that already love it. That has more value to Disney than keeping the ride based on Norway, and Norway isn't paying for the ride going forward - Disney is. No kid is walking into EPCOT thinking, "boy, I sure would like to know a lot more about Norwegian culture", and racing over to the Norway pavilion to get their fill. For Frozen though, the race was on at rope drop, as was the character meet-and-greet next door.

The other thing I think you are going to see dramatically reduced, if not eliminated is the extensive pre and post ride experiences. Sure, you could spend an hour waiting to ride Test Track, but you could spend another hour going through the exhibits after the ride. The only direct benefit Disney sees from that is the gift shop right before you leave the building. Test Track, Mission: Space and Spaceship Earth all have sponsors that pay for those spaces (or at least they did pre-COVID) but I think Disney would much rather you moved on to the gift shop and on to the next attraction. Could be when the sponsor contract is up, you'll see those spaces change too.

Mission Space and Test Track were great experiences that worked in Future World. I think my concern is the dumping of Marvel or Pixar, or whatever it might be into the park and it making no sense. Much of how DCA now feels a park with no identity. If you want thrilling rides you can save your money and go to any amusement park. People want the Disney experience and that is what makes it special and worth the extra money.

 

[Lumpy1106]

But was Maelstrom popular? I would hear people come off the ride and say "that's it? " That ride never had a long line now look at it.
We all miss Disney from our first visits but it wasd never meant to stay the same, the faster everyone acknowledges and accepts this the more you'll enjoy the changes

In the early days, yes, but then there wasn't much in EPCOT like it. I think once people had seen it and started walking through the post-ride show in droves, it's days were numbered. I loved it, I know that. The Norwegians that ran it really made a huge difference.