Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Reaction and Discussion *CONTAINS SPOILERS*

[AMusicLifeForMe]

ok, just back from seeing the movie - I will go back and read the entire thread but thought I would share my initial reaction/thoughts:

First, for my kids, my 8 year old daughter very much enjoyed it but it was too much/too intense for my 6 year old - I thought they would both be ok as they both loved The Force Awakens but just too much for my son .... obviously every kid is different but just one data point for other parents

Second, it is awesome to see a Star Wars movie in the theater opening weekend. Theater was packed, people cheers for the title and at other various points, etc. - the reason why one goes to see movies in the theater

Thirdly, I may have teared up during the credits with the "In loving memory of our Princess Carrie Fisher"

As for my take on it- overall I liked it but it took a bit for me to get into it. The beginning was a bit disjointed and at points the humor wasn't striking the right tone, and also just felt like they were making things up about the force (part of me was like "That's not how the force works!"). ..... BUT then the last half or so, basically from when Rey gets to Snoke's throne room until the end, might be my favorite hour+ of any Star Wars movie - plus it clarified / made sense of something that were "off" to me from the first part - so I think it will take at least one more viewing to really rate it

But I like a lot of the twists they did and, for the most part, the direction they are going in - I think it sets up for a potentially really interesting Episode IX.

So, wasn't perfect, but really enjoyed it - definitely better than The Force Awakens, but probably doesn't topple Empire or Rogue One for me

Thank you for this review. I haven’t quite figured out how to state how I really feel. I agree that the last half was the best part of the movie, but I was confused for the first half. I’m going to see it again sometime next week to see if I can get a bigger grasp on everything. I’m reserving final judgement until then.

 

[hopemax]

I haven't read this thread. We just got back, my DH summed up his review, and I'm copying it here:

#NotMyStarWars

We're wondering what all the kids whose Star Wars was the prequels think of this, because I felt like it had more in common with those (not in a good way). All the work JJ did to restore the look and feel of the Universe, was completely wiped away. Special effects and bad CGI galore (Snoke and Rey, Leia in Space). And this is all I really want to say, because this movie isn't worth the effort. As someone whose life path was set because of my love for the OT (My degree is Aeronautical & Astronautical Engineering BECAUSE of how much I loved ANH) that's a very disappointing realization to come to.

 

[Dis_Fan]

I just got back and here are my quick thoughts on it.

-I really liked how the movie took some lessons from Rogue One. The sacrifices made in the movie had real weight to me.

- To me this was Poes movie. I think he grew the most as a character, and had the best arc. Finn I think was second in terms of development. Rey seemed to leave the movie almost as she began it. But I think they balanced her power vs inexperience better then in Force Awakens.

-There were some good plot twists and surprises but to many bait and switches. I think the movie was trying to have its cake and eat it to in many scenes.

-I was not a fan of throwing away much of Force Awakens. Phasma, Snoke, ect. This did not feel like the second part of a trilogy. It felt like the first part of a new trilogy, only with with just one more movie.

Force Awakens to me turned into a epilogue for the original trilogy and not the begining of something new.

-It was a no win movie. I liked that. The First Order had some victories and major losses. The Resistance had extreme losses but seemed to come out of it renewed and hopeful.

- Didn't mind the humor.

-Enjoyed Yoda. Would of been better with Kenobi but I understand why it would not of worked. Yoda had some mad powers. Why did he not fry the Emperor in ROTJ?

-Was a very good 3 star movie. Dark but exciting an hopeful. Could of been more if it had more cohesion with TFA and did not drop almost everything it introduced.

 

[paradesintherain]

Alright, just got out again and I can say that I definitely liked it. May develop into love, but we'll see.

Funny, the second time around it didn't seem too long. Maybe because the first time I was so anxious to see what was going to happen next things seemed to take too long? I don't know. The casino scene did seem unnecessary and ultimately was the reason why half the Resistance was unable to escape to Crait.

Some more thoughts in no particular order:

• The humor didn't seem so extra to me this time (but I did head to the bathroom during the blue milk scene, so...)
• The floating Leia thing is still weird, but I guess they did a lot more floaty stuff in this movie so it's not entirely out of place.
• Yoda doesn't look as weird to me as Luke did in the flashbacks. Was Luke de-aged or what? And speaking of the flashback, I might have teared up a little when Luke said that he saw the eyes of a "scared boy" looking back at him.
• Luke is the absolute best, his scenes were incredible, and the ending really wrecked me. Force Luke just won't be the same.
• We should have realized something was up with Luke when he showed up on Crait. When I first watched, I thought he had just cut his hair and trimmed his beard, but on second watch I realize it was actually not grey, plus trimmed. On first watch, I was also confused about how he had the blue lightsaber when he had been shown using a green one and the blue one had been ripped in half; though I guess it's possible that there are other blue lightsabers. And then there's the fact that he got into the base in the first place, which Poe mentions.
• The Throne Room lightsaber battle is so epic, I can't even find the proper words for it.
• Actually all of the battles are pretty great. The visuals in the Crait battle are really stunning.
• I'll agree that it maybe felt a bit more like the prequels than the original trilogies, but just the best parts of the prequels.

I'll probably think of a lot more things, and I'm sure I'll see it many more times.

 

[paradesintherain]

Oh AND Snoke revealed that he manipulated the future that Rey and Kylo saw when they touched hands. So I think Snoke also manipulated their seeing Rey's parentage. I could be wrong but I just think there's more to the story...

 

[Miumiu4me]

We saw it last night. I thought some parts were great and some parts really dragged the story down.

- I thought most of the humor fell flat.
- I’m glad Mark Hamill finally learned to act.
- Rose is the single most boring character I’ve ever seen. I thought her storyline with Finn was boring and unnecessary. The casino scene was awful.
- Poe’s character fell flat too.
- No back story for Snoke and Phasma? Really?
- Kylo and Rey’s interactions were the most interesting parts of the movie. My biggest issue with this movie is a lot of the characters make stupid decisions with little reason or consequence. Their interplay was great.

 

[maxiesmom]

Loved it. I was 10 when the first Star Wars came out, and I loved this movie. I was even a bit giddy driving home from it. I couldn't disagree more with most of the criticism.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Among other things, like why Snoke even existed. They set him up in 7 to be this powerful Sith lord, craft intense speculation as to who he is (Is he Plaguius? Why wasn't he in the originals? Where did he come from?!), answer no questions in the lead up to 8 and then kill him off while still answering none of those questions and with no indication that he'll even be back for 9 or any future film.

If anything, this film attempted to narrow the universe as opposed to expanding it and explaining...anything. I like that Rian and Disney are attempting something new and not just copying + pasting, but you need to actually explain where we are in this world, why we're here. Not just make pretty explosions.

Though that's just the writer in me asking for more, I suppose.

I definitely think there were a ton of things brought up in Episode 7 that were hyperanalyzed after and leading up to episode 8 by youtubers and the like - with Snoke probably being second only speculating on Rey's parents .... but I think we are just never going to get all the answers in the films - just would be too much. funny looking back at how many you tube videos I watched speculating on Sokes's black crystal ring alone and then like, nope he dead

Yeah that’s another interesting point. I didn’t mind killing Snoke off but I would’ve loved to know a bit more about him.

I bet this will be books out after Episode 9 with background on Snoke and others ... or heck a standalone "Snoke:A Star Wars Movie" in 2045

 

[TheMaxRebo]

This should have made my rant. You set up Snoke as a uber villain and then kill him the first time appears in person in the next movie with a Darth/Emperor replay with a tiny twist?

The one thing I like about it is that it sets up for an interesting dynamic for Episode 9 as really first time don't have the Rule of 2 in place for the bad guys (although has Kylo abolished that as he wants to end the Sith/Jedi thing? Does he take on an apprentice? Still try to convert Rey?)

I would have liked to see he do a bit more - even though he clearly got to show off a lot of his power in the Throne Room scene

 

[Mr. Mickey]

Saw it at midnight last night here are my few quick thoughts...

I absolutely LOVED the movie. It is easily in my top 3 favorite Star Wars films for many reasons. The story is finaminal, the twists were great, character development, and Yoda!

To anyone still up in the air about this (which I doubt is anyone reading this lol) go watch the movie and don’t listen to the haters.

The kids with me were fine so I’d say yes to taking yours

And finally what the heck was going on with Leia flyin through the air? That is honestly the one part of the movie I didn’t enjoy and I wish was explained. I would say it could be explained in episode 9 but we all know about Carrie Fisher

 

[TheMaxRebo]

As I'm sitting here today and thinking about the movie, I can't help but draw some comparisons that suggest that TLJ is a bit of "greatest hits" compilation from the OT. I enjoyed the movie - even though it may seem as though I'm dumping on it - but like TFA was a bit of retread of Episode IV, a lot of this movie seemed pulled from the OT as a whole. MASSIVE SPOILERS AHEAD....

OT: promising student of the Force visits remote home of curmudgeonly jedi master in exile, who resists training this new arrival
TLJ: promising student of the Force visits remote home of curmudgeonly jedi master in exile, who resists training this new arrival

OT: promising student of the Force wins over jedi master, but shows head strong traits that lead him to explore the part of the swamp strong in the Dark Side
TLJ: promising student of the Force wins over jedi master, but shows head strong traits that lead her to explore the part of the island strong in the Dark Side

OT: promising student of the Force turns himself over to the Imperials in an attempt to turn the Sith apprentice back to the Light, leading to a throne room showdown with the Sith Master
TLJ: promising student of the Force turns herself over to the Imperials in an attempt to turn the Sith apprentice back to the Light, leading to a throne room showdown with the Sith Master

OT: promising student of the Force is tortured by Sith Master until Sith apprentice intervenes and kills Sith Master
TLJ: promising student of the Force is tortured by Sith Master until Sith apprentice intervenes and kills Sith Master

OT: Imperials stage ground assault on fortified Rebel base using Imperial walkers, which the Rebels fight from trenches, turrets and small aircraft
TLJ: Imperials stage ground assault on fortified Resistance base using Imperial walkers, which the Rebels fight from trenches, turrets and small aircraft

OT: Rebel transport ship is chased down by Star Destroyer and eventually loses
TLJ: Resistance transport ship is chased down by Star Destroyer and eventually loses

OT: Small group of Rebels attempts to secretly infiltrate the Death Star and deactivate the tractor beam so they can escape
TLJ: Small group of Resistance fighters attempts to secretly infiltrate the Star Destroyer and deactivate the tracking device so they can escape

OT: Rebels trying to evade the Empire are betrayed by newly introduced character with a penchant for gambling after he sells them out
TLJ: Resistance members trying to evade the First Order are betrayed by newly introduced character with a penchant for gambling after he sells them out

OT: Rebels on Endor surrounded by Imperial troops in a hopeless situation are helped, in part, when one of their own captures an Imperial walker to turn the tide
TLJ: Resistance members on the Star Destroyer surrounded by First Order troops in a hopeless situation are helped, in part, when one of their own captures an Imperial walker to turn the tide

OT: Rebels fly close to the surface of the Death Star to take out turrets so the other pilots can begin their bombing run, which is costly but ultimately successful
TLJ: Poe flies close to the surface of the Dreadnought to take out turrets so the other pilots can begin their bombing run, which is costly but ultimately successful

OT: Jedi master is not completely forthcoming with his pupil about what happened in the past with his student Vader and presents the truth "from a certain point of view"
TLJ: Jedi master is not completely forthcoming with his pupil about what happened in the past with his student Kylo and presents the truth "from a certain point of view"

OT: Jedi master selflessly sacrifices himself in a fight with his former pupil so that the "new hope" can escape
TLJ: Jedi master selflessly sacrifices himself in a fight with his former pupil so that the "spark of rebellion" can escape

OT: mysterious Boba Fett, fan favorite with a cool helmet, appears to die when he's hit with a staff during a fight and then falls into the Sarlaac
TLJ: mysterious Captain Phasma, fan favorite with a cool helmet, appears to die when she's hit with a baton during a fight and then falls into a fire below

I could go on - but the number of parallels is a pretty impressive. My last point - and one not mentioned prior to now - is: did they really need to kill off Ackbar and just throw in that line that, oh yeah, he's dead (since he couldn't propel himself back to safety with the Force like Leia). A trap, indeed....

I don't disagree (though I have also mapped out all the comparison of Star Wars to Moana so some of it is just they all use a lot of classic story telling tropes)

The interesting thing to me is that the things you pointed out in the OT took the full three movies/story arc to tell while we still have a whole third act with the new films so it think that makes it interesting.

E.g., Instead of Bad guy is redeemed at the end and kills his master, now it happened in the middle and didn't fully turn good - just made himself new supreme leader but now without his own apprentice, etc

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Just curious if other theater crowds were similar...our theater last night erupted when Luke brushed off his shoulder. Not quiet laughter/surprise but actual excited yelling/screaming!

We had a very active theater - cheered when the title screen came up and a bunch of other spots including the hand brush but also a it was like palpable the moment you realized Luke was only Force projecting

 

[Mr. Mickey]

Not trying to offend anyone here but I feel that if you didn’t like the movie it’s because it was different from the Star Wars everyone knows and loves. People bashed TFA because it was too much like New Hope so when Disney goes out and does something different, everyone hates it. I don’t even know anymore. I’m not trying to speak for anyone but that’s how I feel.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Leia absolutely deserved to have gone out with a heroic bang. And that absurd flying through space thing made her look like a Marvel hero, not Star Wars.

Now the only lead character from the original series we'll see alive in Episode 9 is Chewie. Though hopefully they have enough already-filmed footage to give Leia the good-bye she deserves.

Ironic to look for another death - when this movie was so gratuitously filled with rebel deaths. All those X-Wing pilots in the X-Wing hangar, a huge part of the Resistance leadership including Ackbar (with no pomp and circumstance), all the pilots on the bombers at the beginning of the movie, all the pilots of the gutted speeders at the end (and they show us their faces just before they blow them up). All the filled transports. The commanders of the cruisers. Vice-Admiral Hoo-Doo in her slinky cocktail dress (wat?). We have ten Resistance people left on Crait.

They obviously wanted us to feel hopeless. They send out a distress call to the galaxy and NO ONE comes? No one? The scene of the stable boy at the end felt like a patch. Kathleen Kennedy (who, in my opinion, failed us in this film) said, "This is too hopeless." (As she said when she made them re-film the end of ROGUE ONE. Man, what must the original ending have been like if the finished product was the cheerful version??) So they patch on a little kid who uses the Force on a broom and wears the Resistance ring. He's the future of the Resistance? 15 or 20 years away? And he got the final scene.

First, I agree the floating / Mary poppins Leia was not great - really was thinking "I don't think that is how the Force works"

As to the ending though - I think it tied to the speech that's Finn gave about how people know our sign and that is the hope - so you see the kid with the ring at the end to show you that there are places out there that still believe in the sign, etc

Also, just cause they didn't answer the signal in this movie doesn't mean no one comes to support in the future - they could have worried it was a trap, etc

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I think some people expect too much out of the movies themselves. There is only so much you can do in two hours. How much exposition did we really get out of the original Trilogy? It wasn't until the prequels and tons of books and comic books and games that filled in a lot of the blanks.

They key to Star Wars is everything else around it. Books, toys, comic books that expands upon scenes and characters you see for a few seconds in the films. Boba Fett is the same cool LOOKING character (like Phasma) that is more of a footnote in the movie, but make people want to know more about them.

So I suspect we'll see something to expand upon Snoke's rise .. a book .. a comic .. maybe a future movie.

I mean TFA gave us nothing about how the First Order came to be after the Empire, but a book (Bloodline - by Claudia Gray) goes into the political machinations that lead to the secret formation of what would become the First Order and how Leia recognizes what happens and begins the Resistance. Things that cannot be put into a 2 hour movie (without it being boring), but really adds to the world.

I see the movies as just a "start" of the world .. a way to introduce some great new characters and kick start the next "generation" of Star Wars to enjoy all the other things outside the movies - toys, books, and theme park rides!

Fully agree and Phasma already has a book and is in other books that explains why she is such a bad ***

Also goes to show how with the internet now people can really hype analyze every detail and wonder about meanings and stuff and no way everything can be answered in a 3 hour movie - which should be more action and less exposition anyway (unless you are the prequels)

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Eh .. I didn't mind Luke being flippant . .he wanted to leave behind his past and someone shoved it back in his face.

Is it any different than a little green, wise, old Jedi Master acting like a goofy, silly thief, when confronted by a future student?

That is how I took it as well - almost trying to make an explicit point that he was separating himself from his old life, etc

I do see it as quite jarring compared to the beautiful scene with dramatic music at the end of episode 7 so can get people not liking it and like a swerve for the sake of a swerve

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I wanted to like it, too. Too much. I avoided spoilers, but saw some review headlines. Best STAR WARS movie since EMPIRE. Saw that more than once. I wish I hadn't gone in with such high expectations. I would have liked the movie more if I had known it was a stinker in advance.

TFA premiere was noisy and joyful - I also don't remember leaving a movie with a better feeling. Last night, people filed out in silence. No excitement. No eagerness for the next movie.

Milking that Thing was just gross and pointless. There was an adolescent quality to a lot of the humor.

Luke's flippant flip of the light saber (which Obi Wan had given him, which belonged to his redeemed father, which he lost along with this hand at an incredibly painful and poignant moment in his life) over his shoulder felt like something a teen-aged boy would come up with. It felt disrespectful and dismissive of the incredibly beautiful scene set by JJ Abrams at the end of TFA. Hey, let's do something unexpected! Ha ha! Let's be irreverent - that's super Current Year, right? It was flippant, irreverent, adolescent - and most definitely not Star Wars.

Rian Johnson had to put his stamp on it. His irreverence was hubris. And the homage to JURASSIC PARK was self-indulgent (the contents of the champagne glass vibrating - starting with one drop and building, caused by giant thundering beasts).

Maybe different crowds impact things? How theater was cheering and pouring talking about things on the way out

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Leia used the force and I liked it! I’ve been waiting 40 years to see it though

I am all for her using the Force but that did seem a bit much - she isn't trained as a Force user (well i think Luke has done a bit but not like a Jedi) so her to survive in open space and do things you never even see a Jedi do I think was a bit much

They could have even just had the same scene but her holding on to something inside and then unknowingly use the force to activate a switch to put up deflector shields or something - so similar effect but more believable

 

[TheMaxRebo]

It was like Mulligatawny Stew. So many throw-aways and cop outs.

Rey's parents (nobodies). Snoke's origins (who cares?). How Kylo resolved the conflict within (poof!). Maz's friend with the red flower on his lapel (skip him - let's go with this coke-head Mad Dog Murdock instead - maybe he has a heart of gold, he returns Rose's pendant - naaah, he sells them out). A vice admiral in a nightgown? (ooh, purple hair!)

The best pilot in the resistance is a mutineer (who cares?).

Knights of Ren (who?). Suddenly Snoke thinks that Kylo's Vadarific mask is ridiculous (which he wore effectively throughout TFA)? Where did that come from? Rian Johnson dissing TFA, that's where it came from. Grandfather may well have been appearing to Kylo, according to TFA. ("Show me again ...") They shouldn't have thrown that reference away. Show us Vader showing Kylo the dark side. Show us how Snoke was faking that interaction. Heck, give us an aged Hayden Christensen as a Force ghost - revealing to Kylo that Snoke has been manipulating him.

And here is Rey entering her own Force Cave (like Luke on Dagobah), answering something calling to her, for a big reveal, a formative experience, enlightenment. (Nada.)

RUNNING OUT OF FUEL?? For two and a half hours? With time for a visit to the Trumpo Bites Casino? (Come on.)

I do agree that the whole connection between Kyle and Vader seems disjointed now

In TFA he was all about "I was to finish what you started Grandfather" - and now he is "you need to cut off all your past" ... what caused him to change? And if this was really driven by him feeling Luke turned on him then why after that would he draw inspiration from his Grandfather. I know he looks at Vader separate than Anakin - but then he should have referred to him as just Vader in TFA and not "Grandfather"

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I know it’s hard to compare but when Episode 5 came out were reactions mixed like this as well? I’m sure after 4 people had certain expectations obviously not like today but you always expect a sequel to go one way or another.

Big difference is in the early 80s you didn't have 700 YouTube channels devoted to breaking down every little detail in episode 4 to see what answers where coming in episode 5

I mean, you can picture some of the snarky comments that could come if Episode 5 came out now "what, is Luke a Jedi or Tarzan swinging on vines?